From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Thursday, April 27, 2006 9:32 AM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : RE: VMs: Knights Templar & f86v nine-rosettes
Steve
I was hoping someone would bring that subject up, so I can express my thoughts on it from a position of answering, rather than initiating.
Let us suppose that there is a secret, or semi-secret society, and it necessarily has some measure of public relations. The study of material that may, even remotely, relate to such a society, will need to take with a grain of salt, and not in the derogatory sense, statements issued by that society, publicly or semi-publicly, on matters regarding the study.
For example, suppose that secret society XYZ has in the past stated: yes, we use this ABC system of ciphers, but only our lower initiates use it, and ABC is not even remotely connected with our higher cipher system which we never talk about. That has to be taken with a grain of salt, because, coming from a source whose intent is to maintain secrets, none of its public statements can be taken at face value, and there is the possibility that ABC is intentionally advertised as a pedestrian cipher, when in actuality it is openly used in clever ways to accomplish much more.
But by now we ought to be used to things of this nature, especially in these online days. We would be naive if we had not by now noticed the traces left on this and other Voynich study and discussion lists by concealed personalities around the world whose job it is to monitor VMS developments for the possibility of knowledge useful to their employers. And imagine how frustrating it sometimes is for such a someone in the pure observer role when they get a good VMS idea, but they cannot share their creativity openly.
The communications going on on this list often have multiple layers to them. An obvious example, that is obvious to a certain subset of this list, is the use of "Z" as a variable in mathematical equations - aside from its utility as a variable-label it sometimes signals the message: keep open-minded to the possibility that something akin to complex variables may enter these considerations in the future as intrinsic to the material. It is a way of signalling that thought without openly rattling taboos, and maintaining respect for orthodox views to the extent that is necessary for progress.
I think we can expect that if it turns out that the VMS decodes to something important and especially useful, that at the stage when it is safe to do so, various organizations may lay claim to its ancestry. That's only human nature. And in the meantime, insofar as go such considerations by those who are concerned with them, result in subtle resistances to decoding Templar or other such potentially exciting themes in the VMS, it too is part of the quest of trying to understand this book.
Berj
From: "Steve Ekwall" <>
Reply-To: vms-list@voynich.net
To: vms-list@voynich.net
Subject: RE: VMs: Knights Templar & f86v nine-rosettes
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 01:00:30 -0600
Interesting of note (maybe?) is that I was a member of the DeMolay (as in Jacques de Molay) and my father was a 32nd if not 33rd degree mason.... he stopped talking about it then.
-=se=-
steve (Friday 13th) ekwall
From: "Berj N. Ensanian" <>
Reply-To: vms-list@voynich.net
To: vms-list@voynich.net
Subject: VMs: Knights Templar & f86v nine-rosettes
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2006 17:08:46 -0400
Concerning the possibility of Voynich Manuscript and Knights Templar connection (1), I just had a look at .....
******************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Friday, April 28, 2006 1:14 AM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript
We shall have data.
- Charles Fort
Toward the hypothesis that there is a Knights Templar and/or Masons connection in the VMS, I have a few more observations to report. Everything here following continues the developments in ref. (1). Most of the following will concern the very heart of the Voynich Manuscript - the central rosette/medallion of the 9-rosettes foldout, that is, the central medallion of f86v.
At this point it can be said, I think, that exploration of Templars and closely related themes, is long overdue in Voynich research. Mary D'Imperio in her pivotal book, makes a strong case for investigating Rosicrucian connections (2). More recently, the archives of this vms-list show, that Dennis Stallings repeatedly called for a good Templar theory, over the period January, 1999, to May, 2001, but the idea did not take root. We shall hope for progress, now that some interesting data is starting to accumulate.
We have seen that the number 6, aside from all else, plays a central role in the potentially most important and most dramatic of all possibilities for the Voynich manuscript: that the book encodes in-advance-of-its-time prime numbers theorems. And this prime numbers observation is the cornerstone for the hypothesis that the VMS author is a mathematician. By following the principles of that hypothesis I came to the sudden and unexpected realization that Knights Templar, and Masons, may be in the VMS. (1)
In the following we'll again see 6 prominent, and again accompanied by primes and universally significant non-primes, but the focus will not be mathematics.
Before dealing with the new observations on f86v, I briefly list some observations from other Voynich pages, some of which have obvious similarities with Templar and Masonic symbolism, and some of which are more readily associated with the number 6.
I. The f57v circular diagram contains unmistakable instances of the Masonic cipher (3). This diagram has 4 concentric bands filled with Voynich words and symbols. At the 12 o'clock position, in the 3rd band out from the center, being the 2nd band in from the perimeter, there occurs the GC-204, inbetween gallows letters. I had been aware of GC-204 all along, but always skipped by it as just another Voynich weirdo symbol to be delt with sometime in the future. Then a few days ago, offlist, Elias Schwerdtfeger invited me to join the German Voynich study group. When I went to look over the yahoo-hosted voynich-de (4), I saw that its founder, Jonathan Dilas, had online webpages devoted to the VMS, and I went there to have a look (5). When I got there, I saw Jonathan's exhibit of some transcribed Voynich text prominently featuring GC-204, and being in the Templars/Masons frame-of-mind, this GC-204 symbol suddenly struck me for what it is: a dead-ringer for a Masonic cipher coded group. Even if the VMS author had not intended that, it is nevertheless a dead-ringer for it. Depending on the interpretation of the hollow dot, as opposed to solid dot, it could simply decode to "LV", which in turn could decode to 55, or 5 emphasized by repitition. 50 and 5 are common ancient number symbols, of course. Symbols similar to GC-204 occur in the same band, and also in the inner band of f57v.
II. The f72v "Libra" diagram: the scales resemble a plumb or level as much as they do weighing scales.
III. The f73v "Sagittarius" diagram: the "crossbow" is aimed down, and its arrow points directly at the VMS symbol EVA-t / GC-k, being the 2nd letter of a word from among 8 or 9 words on the inner word-band. The 6th letter of that 6-letters word is ligatured to the crossbow. Aside from the possible sexual symbolism with the immediately radially positioned nymph, that nymph is the only one of the 10 nymphs in her nymph-ring who has her handheld star lowered, and toward the crossbow. The "crossbow", in conjunction with that star does have affinities with a Masonic symbol (3).
IV. The f85v 3-page cosmological foldout has from left to right, two circular diagrams, and then a text page on the far right.
IVa. The left circular diagram has 4 men placed evenly around the central sun-medallion, each featuring a distinct theme. The lower one could be seen as a craftsman wearing an apron. The right-side one is holding up a vessel, perhaps one filled with oil. The left-side man is holding something that I have not yet found an explanation for, but it certainly looks important. The upper (top) man is clearly transmitting a hand-signal.
IVb. The middle circular diagram has figures embedded in its wreath-like main band. It requires high resolution images to see them well. These figures are projecting symbols with objects held in their hands. The upper (top) figure is seen from behind, and in its left hand it holds up a 7-branched little shrub, reminiscent of the tree of life. The overall suggestion is reminiscent of Jesus preaching to the assembled masses.
Now to the heart of the Voynich Manuscript: the grand nine-rosettes labrynth that is f86v. The color that f86v features primarily, is blue.
One of f86v's most obvious features is the number pair 13 and 7, and we have noted that 1307 is the year the Templar Order's catastrophe began. We have seen that even the parchment foldings of f86v are consistent with the recurring symbolism of the VMS: the parchment's folding produces first the major upper and lower halves, and two more foldings produce altogether 6 pages, and thereby also the Templar double-bar cross (1).
In turn, the heart of the 9-rosettes is the central one of its 9 medallions, being also larger than the other 8. The central rosette/medallion of f86v is drawn across the middle, horizontal, folding of the parchment, and therefore we can refer to its upper and lower halves.
Analysis of this central medallion suggests a 3-dimensional structure. For our purposes here, we will divide it into the following major sections:
1. The inner/central circular or elliptical platform, bearing upon it a complex 3-dimensional structure. The platform's base is also complex, resembling #2, next.
2. A surrounding "tombstones-wall", so-called because it looks like it is made up of a tremendous number of crowded together tombstones, each with a single small mark on it. This wall's outer extremity is ringed with closely spaced cilia-like radial strokes.
3. A surrounding moat, containing 19 radially placed Voynich words, 12 in the rosette's lower half, and 7 in the upper. The moat is also partly traversed, longitudinally, and almost entirely only in the upper half, by an ornamental line that suggests, aside from water waves, ratios between the numbers 2,3, and 8.
4. A surrounding band of longitudinally written Voynich words, divided by two familiar box-like symbols, these box-symbols suggesting a cross and the numbers 4 and 2. One of these boxes is positioned in the upper half at just a little clockwise from 12 o'clock, and the lower one is positioned just before the 6 o'clock position.
5. A surrounding final, and 3rd tombstones-wall, much more complex than the #2 wall. This outer wall has several structural elements, but outstanding are 12 bases-embedded, radial, clusters of scrolls or tubes, 7 clusters in the upper-half, and 5 in the lower. Each cluster consists of 6 tubes (or scrolls), with, in most cases, one tube being larger and longer than the others in its cluster. These tube-clusters are similar to a large 5-tube cluster that emanates radially from the upper-left rosette, and points toward the central rosette with a spearhead consisting of a Voynich word of 6 letters. When the f86v layout is viewed from a distance, this 5-tubes cluster and spearhead-word gives the noticable impression of a cross, and also it is diagonally opposite the other obvious cross in f86v: the blue colored object in the lower-right rosette that has a strong similarity to Templar-founder Hughes de Payens' personal seal (6).
6. Fan-shaped coupling streams, 4 in number, connecting the central rosette to the rosettes to its left and right, and top and bottom, altogether suggesting yet another cross of the Templar/ Maltese / Iron or Celtic Cross class. The narrow ends of the fans are at the central rosette. Because of parchment folding, the left and right fans are difficult to make out. The lower fan, on account of chevron-like strokes, suggests an outflow from the central rosette to the lower-middle rosette.
Let us now go directly to the heart of the heart, the central medallion's inner platform, described in #1 above. It's base is also made of "tombstones". The "tombstones" might symbolize souls, or actually symbolize tombstones, in turn symbolizing all the fighters who gave their lives to the Holy Land.
The floor atop the platform has 5 lines, more or less parallel, of Voynich script, grouped 4 and 1 from left to right. If, from the left, we number these lines 1-5, then line 2 is the only one not containing a gallows letter.
The platform supports a 3-dimensional structure of some complexity, but basically it amounts to 6 onion-domed pillars surrounding, or supporting, a sheet or plate or canopy, that has 13 3-fingered stretches, and bears 70 6-rayed stars. The stars are drawn simply from 3 crossing single strokes. There is sufficient blue coloring on the sheet to give the impression that this canopy of stars is indeed celestially symbolic.
Thus we see that f86v, at its grossest level, namely the parchment it is rendered on, starts with a display of the number 6, and ends in the heart of its heart with 6-rayed stars.
We now propose that the f86v central rosette symbolizes Jerusalem, and its inner platform symbolizes the Jerusalem Temple, Solomon's Temple.
To amplify this proposal we first appeal to the authority of Cirlot (7):
"The idea of the world as a labrynth or of life as a pilgrimage leads to the idea of the 'centre' as a symbol of the absolute goal of Man - Paradise regained, heavenly Jerusalem."
"This leads us towards an intuition of the world as a vast repertoire of signs that await being 'read'. We note here that some of the works of Trithemius and Athanasius Kircher tend towards this interpretation."
"The walled city is also an image of the 'spiritual centre'. It appears to have been portrayed thus by Domenico di Michelino in his image of Dante; and it also appears frequently in this guise in the Middle Ages as the 'celestial Jerusalem'."
"The Promised Land - the Holy Land - was, for the alchemists, with their concept of the three worlds as 'states' and of landscapes as 'expressions', the 'final stage of an experiment'. ..... Dante described Jerusalem as the 'pole of the spirit'."
"On the other hand, the Tree of Life, as found in the celestial Jerusalem, bears twelve fruits, or sun-shapes (symbols of the Zodiac, perhaps)."
"Solomon's Temple, according to Philo and Flavius Josephus, was a figurative representation of the cosmos, and its interior was disposed accordingly: the incense table signified thanksgiving; the seven-branched candelabra stood for the seven planetary heavens; the holy table represented the terrestrial order. In addition to this, the twelve loaves of bread corresponded to the twelve months of the year."
Now let us turn to the chapters of I. KINGS describing the construction of Solomon's Temple:
"So also made he for the entrance of the temple door-posts of olive-wood, out of a fourth part of the wall; and two doors of firwood: the two leaves of the one door were folding, and the two leaves of the other door were folding."
"And he built the inner court with three courses of hewn stone, and a course of cedar beams."
"So was he seven years in building it."
"And Solomon was building his own house thirteen years, and he finished all his house."
"..... fifty cubits ..... fifty cubits ..... five cubits ..... five cubits ..... and the pomegranates were two hundred ....."
And from the recounting of it in II. CHRONICLES:
"Now therefore send me a man skilful to work in gold, and in silver, and in brass, and in iron, and in purple, and crimson, and blue..."
..... six hundred ducats ....." oops! Correction: 600 talents!
"..... it received and held three thousand baths."
In the book of the warrior, JOSHUA, in the 19th chapter, we read about the 6th lot for the children of Naphtali: 19 cities with their villages.
And it is hardly necessary to refer to the first chapter of GENESIS where the number 6 begins its significant and frequent appearances throughout the Bible, Old Testament and New: God made the heavens and the earth in 6 days. Also, the legend of Solomon's Seal, according to many authorities, is the familiar crossed triangles of altogether 6 points.
Finally let us look at the onion-domed columns or pillars that surround/support the celestial canopy with its LXX stars. We shall propose that they too symbolize Solomon's Temple, but with a Christian element incorporated, for the tops of the onions suggest, if only subliminally, a cross. 4 of these odd columns are in the foreground, and the other two are greatly obscured behind the star-canopy. Of these 2, one has its base visible, and if we allow that the symbolism extends to that intentionally, rather than artistic accident, then we could take it to mean that those two columns are symbolically "different", as in Jachin and Boaz.
But the connection with Solomon's Temple, AND the Knights Templar, reaches its dramatic coincidence when we examine the reverse side of the Seal of the Knights Templar, the de Blanchfort Seal (8). There it is. The correspondence is about as good as it could be, subject to the requirement that the VMS, and therefore f86v, be esoteric.
If we look carefully at the peak of the leftmost onion-domed column, we see what appears to be attached to it an EVA-n / GC-N symbol. It could be interpreted as a crescent. If the crescent is then interpreted as a Muslim symbol, we recall that relations between Christians and Muslims were not always bad back in those days, and indeed the Templars financed Muslims in the Holy Land at times. An alternate interpretation is the crescent as a symbol of the feminine principle, and from there the possibility that a woman had a hand in the VMS, possibly as the scribe and/or illustrator.
Now let me briefly explain why I used some sudden humor during the middle of all this. For a long time now I have strongly suspected that the VMS has not, over the centuries, been quite as mysterious as we generally deem it, and that at least some people have known, or suspected, what this book is, but were, for one reason or another, not willing to let that be known. If the tentative history that has been constructed for the VMS is really essentially true, then Athanasius Kircher is one of the men I have in mind as having known very well what the VMS was, but he having very good reasons not to be, in any way, publicly associated with it. In other words, it is not that he couldn't figure it out, but exactly the opposite - he figured it out and he knew it could get him into a lot of trouble to stir up the Knights Templar hornets nest. So that's the thought behind the 600 ducats, er, I mean 600 talents.
Concerning the hunt for plausible mathematical talent behind the VMS, I had a while ago asked the question if there was in the history of mathematics an ultra-prime mystery (9). On that, Jeff Haley produced a highly interesting and possibly productive lead concerning the Codice Palatino 573 (10), but it is written in Italian, and alas I cannot read it.
Berj / KI3U
(1) see vms-list post: VMs: Templars, Masons, and Voynich, 23 April 2006.
(2) The Voynich Manuscript - An Elegant Enigma, by M.E. D'Imperio, Aegean Park Press, ISBN 0-89412-038-7, see page 62, also (1) above.
(3) see, for example: http://www.odr.org/anonymous/fam-code.htm http://scard.buffnet.net/cipher/pigpencipher.html http://altreligion.about.com/library/glossary/symbols/bldefsmcipher.htm
(4) http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/voynich-de/
(5) http://www.dilas-arts.de/Texte/voynich.html
(6) see vms-list post: VMs: Knights Templar & f86v nine-rosettes, April 22, 2006.
(7) A Dictionary of Symbols, by J.E. Cirlot, 1962, translated from the Spanish by Jack Sage, 1971, Routledge & Kegan Paul Ltd.; 2nd Ed. Barnes & Noble, 1995.
(8) see for example: http://www.templarhistory.com/seal.html
(9) vms-list: VMs: braided prime number equations in f6r, April 4, 2006.
(10) http://www2.math.unifi.it/~archimede/archimede/fibonacci/catalogo/ulivi.php
****************************************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Monday, May 1, 2006 10:11 AM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : VMs: Christianity symbolism in the VMS
I have been looking more into Christianity symbolism in the VMS since pursuing the hypothesis that Knights Templar and Masons are involved in the book (1). Of course there is the most obvious of all: f79v, where a nymph appears to be blessing the page's first text-paragraph with a cross held out in her hand. But here I want to list a previously not disussed, as far as I know, example of possible Christianity symbolism, in f86v, the 9-rosette foldout that I have concentrated on lately, namely the socalled "clock"; the following would be consistent with the Knights Templar theme.
Before discussing the clock, I mention a wonderful resource I found online for information and images of Crusader inscriptions in the Holy Land (2).
One of the book's plates of early Christian symbols shows one that is essentially identical to the gallows symbol EVA-t / GC-k:
http://www.christusrex.org/www2/cruce5/c5191.html
The gallows similar is in the same row as the metric ruler, and at extreme left.
Plates with some more such symbols are here:
http://www.christusrex.org/www2/cruce5/c5245.html
http://www.christusrex.org/www2/cruce5/c5297.html
http://www.christusrex.org/www2/cruce5/c5179.html
With Christianity symbolism in mind, the VMS's balneological people-in-tubs depictions, for example f71v, may symbolize baptism and baptismal tubs, and Fr. Sabino's book has this picture of interest:
http://www.christusrex.org/www2/cruce5/c5278.html
Two more possibly interesting pictures are at:
http://www.christusrex.org/www2/cruce5/c5241.html
http://www.christusrex.org/www2/cruce5/c5047.html
and finally a picture that may have bearing on the VMS f68v "spiral galaxy" is also featured on the backcover of Fr. Sabino's book.
Now to f86v, and the clock. The f86v nine-rosettes are 9 medallions arranged in a square 3x3. At the upper-left and lower-right corners are sun symbols and additional things. At the upper-right corner is a possible T-map-symbol with other things (see vms-list archives for map discussions on this). And at the lower-left corner is the socalled clock with its associated text.
We can note that the upper-left medallion is reminiscent of an aureole. And in the lower-left medallion at about the 2 o'clock position, is an object that does resemble a beehive, and the beehive is one of the main symbols of St. Bernard of Clairvaux, the patron of the Templar Knights.
The clock group stikes the eye especially, because with its associated text the group's longitudinal axis is radial to the center of f86v, suggesting that this group is a symbolic entry to the entire f86v diagram. So, here is a try at interpreting this group as esoteric Christian symbolism:
The group starts with text at the radial extreme: In the beginning was the Word... (opening of the Gospel of John).
Because we have already identified the central rosette to symbolize Jerusalem and the Temple of Solomon, ref. (1), we assume that the entry symbols group has something to do with the Temple: the circle of the clock somehow relates to the temple. Its perimeter-band is surrounded by text, and it itself contains 24 radial strokes arranged in 8 groups of 3.
Next we examine the inside of the circle, which contains what looks like an equilateral L with a little square at its right-angle corner, and loops at the ends of the two arms. On closer examination we find that the L is not an L at all - its two arms do not meet at the corner, and the .sid image reveals that this is quite intentional - the two arms are meant to be separate objects, although they have been so cleverly drawn that a casual observation makes it appear that the arms are joined.
From the .sid image it turns out that the horizontal arm is actually a straightforward symbol for a key, but turned upside down. The vertical arm looks like a Latin letter P with a long descender, or a Greek rho.
The key suggests it is symbolizing Peter, and thus the vertical arm is, within context, acceptable as a symbolic sword, and therefore it symbolizes Paul. That the Peter and Paul symbols are positioned at a right angle with respect to one another, now makes perfect sense from the point of view that the VMS author is a mathematician (1): the arms are their own unique projections, as Petrine and Pauline Christianity are their own unique, and very different forms of Christianity. Apparently there is some additional symbolic conflict: Peter's symbol is turned upside down, with Paul triumphant straight-up above it.
At this point we have two major Christian figures associated with the temple, and the numbers 3,8, and 24. Chapter 11 of the Revelation of John is suggested: some authorities consider it the most important and mysterious chapter in Revelation. It deals with the fate of God's Temple, and includes the 3rd woe, and the 24 elders, and the 2 mysterious witnesses, which some authorities have speculated could be Enoch and Elijah, or Peter and Paul. Here we take it that the VMS author intends Peter and Paul, reasonable because their legacies can certainly be seen as witnesses to God's dealings.
We are left to decode the number 8. In Revelation there is one chapter where 8 is strongly featured: chapter 17, wherein a mysterious was-and-is-not beast is an 8th while also one of 7.
More could be done with this symbols group, in particular the text that wraps around the clock.
Let us play devil's advocate for a moment, and attack the foregoing at its pivot-point: the assertion that the arms of the "L" are intentionally not connected. Could the not-connectedness be a result of parchment aging/stretching or ink disintegration, as per arguements against Newbold's deciphering scheme? From the .sid image we see what could be evidence of that in the handle-end of the Peter-key, but its lock-end, and the tip of Paul's sword seem completely without any hints of distortions, and their inks appear quite clear. The possible distortion at the handle-end of the Peter-key has no essential effect on the foregoing analysis.
In concluding this post, I note that as the Templars-Masons-Christianity-and-related hypothesis is currently evolving, everything seems to be wrapped around themes of upheaval in Christianity. I would not be surprised if the Protestant Reformation schism is also symbolized somewhere in f86v, or elsewhere in the VMS; if yes, that would push the VMS date into the early 16th century.
From this upheavals viewpoint, a heavy atmosphere seems to be pervading the VMS; this is not inconsistent with the observation made in the post of ref. 1, that among previous persons suspected of having had contact with the VMS, like Athanasius Kircher, some reacted with suppressive tactics. In modern times in connection with that thought we have the case of the VMS pages that mysteriously went missing since Newbold's day.
Berj
(1) see vms-list post: VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript, April 28, 2006.
(2) http://www.christusrex.org/www2/cruce5/index.html#signorie
Corpus Inscriptionum Crucesignatorum Terrae Sanctae;
Anthology of Crusader Inscriptions in the Holy Land (1099-1291, by
Sabino De Sandoli, OFM. Father Sabino De Sandoli's "Corpus Inscriptionum" is the most extensive collection of surviving Crusader inscriptions ever published. The inscriptions, written between 1099 and 1291, have been collected from all areas of Palestine: from Gaza to Acre, from Hebron to Banias, and from the southern part of Transjordan. "Corpus Inscriptionum Crucesignatorum Terrae Sanctae" was published in 1973 by Studium Biblicum Franciscanum and the Franciscan Printing Press in Jerusalem.
******************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Monday, May 1, 2006 5:07 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : VMs: f86v clock text
I noted earlier (1) that more could be done with the text associated with f86v's clock. I just noticed something: The clock-text's opening word consists of 9 symbols (another featuring of 9 in f86v !), and the 8th and 9th of these are the VMS symbols that resemble 8 and 9. Possibly this first word is presenting a numerical key of sorts.
Berj
(1) vms-list: Christianity symbolism in the VMS, May 1, 2006.
*************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Monday, May 1, 2006 7:23 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : RE: VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript
From: "Steve Ekwall" <>
Reply-To: vms-list@voynich.net
To: vms-list@voynich.net
Subject: RE: VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript
Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 16:51:39 -0600
From: "Berj N. Ensanian" <>
III. The f73v "Sagittarius.......
Good eye... The EVA-t / GC-k is the Folding #1 START Character and the arrow couldn't be more 'pointing @ it', unless it was bleeding blood or something. :-o
another for what it is worth thought is that ES never laugh'd so hard as when I ask about the stars and still laughing convyied "Those are not stars, they (with a dot in the center) are succesful male births. Till your good eye spotted it, I hadn't noted the 'star' being the lone one down. If there is a dot in it = good? if there is no DOT-in-Star = ?? maybe muslim/arabic as mohamed had no male heirs?
hope that helps
best to you & yours
-=se=- steve (good start / #1 / starting point !!) ekwall :-)
Hi Steve
I'm not sure about the possible Muslim and Arabic influences in the VMS: for exmple, it turns out that the crescent moon was a symbol used by the Christians before there was Mohammed. It all gets more and more complicated it seems.
I did not notice the lowered star in the Sagittarius either until just recently - what is amazing me more and more is the number of details in the VMS illustrations that escape even repeated looking, until you have a specific theme in mind. For example, the reason I spotted that lowered star was because I was looking for 9 nymphs on that nymph-band, and counting 10. That's when I saw the lowered star, and said: Oh!
But I have to admit, that what just about made me fall out of my chair in the last several days, was in connection with f86v's parchment foldings, when I read I KINGS 6:34 - my first thought was "Ekwall !"
:-)
Berj
**************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Monday, May 1, 2006 10:13 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : RE: VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript
From: "Steve Ekwall" <>
Reply-To: vms-list@voynich.net
To: vms-list@voynich.net
Subject: RE: VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript
Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 18:35:29 -0600
From: "Berj N. Ensanian" <>
(3) see, for example: http://www.odr.org/anonymous/fam-code.htm
http://scard.buffnet.net/cipher/pigpencipher.html
http://altreligion.about.com/library/glossary/symbols/bldefsmcipher.htm
(4) http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/voynich-de/
wOw, HOW COOL - thx berj :-) ................
Steve
Well that's a lot of stuff to digest properly, and I'll have to go over, carefully, what you've written. As I indicated a bunch of posts ago, I have no problem with unconventionally obtained data, as long as the data turns out to be good.
Some preliminary reply-comments:
Within Christianity symbolism I can easily see the symbolic transformation 12 Apostles = 12 zodiac signs, allowing a bunch of possibilities.
Kabala is itself based on much older mysteries traditions.
As for "won't be able to read it", I go back to my comments on unconventionally obtained information: it is more often than not symbolic rather than literal, and requires interpretation (like so many things in life!). Therefore, if that particular piece of data, namely "unreadable", turns out to be correct, then I could take it to mean that the secret will not be displayed in readable text. Rather it will be imparted in some other way. And that is consistent with the not-new idea that much of the Voynich text is not a recording of speech-based language. For example, as previously posted, I've already based some of my analyses on the idea that some pieces of "text" are mathematical objects. And you have gallows as pointers. To sum it up, "won't be able to read it" does not necessarily mean not being able to understand it. Not at all, as far as I am concerned.
At this stage, I believe that the VMS "text" is divided across several types of use, including purely mathematical, but also I believe that some paragraphs are actually speech-based script in some language(s).
And needless to say, with the current hypothesis, we are certainly decoding, but not "reading".
Concerning the gallows letters and their relationships and meanings, I just went over my notes from January, when I was full-tilt into investigating gallows - eventually finding them showing up all over the place from ancient Athenian Curse Tablets, to the ceiling mosaics of the monastery of Hossios Loukas. Early in February I had a conclusion about the gallows that I've been reluctant to post until now. However, with this thread, and its related threads exploring the Christianity possibilities in the Voynich Manuscript, it seems worthwhile to mention my conclusions here, with the caveat that they remain preliminary at this stage, and I am not firm on them.
These conclusions are based on a unifying idea which is this: the gallows letters are text-symbol pictorial representations of 4 aspects of Jesu Christi. Namely:
EVA-t / GC-k = Jesus the Saviour, with outstretched arms.
EVA-k / GC-h = Jesus the Good Shepherd, with his shepherd's staff.
EVA-p / GC-g = Jesus crucified, up on the cross, but still alive.
EVA-f / GC-f = Jesus crucified, dead, the Spirit ascended.
In addition, concerning intruding gallows, I have in my notes:
EVA-ch / GC-1 = Golgotha / Calvary
Berj / KI3U
***************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, May 2, 2006 12:58 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : RE: VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript
I don't think your implied proposal is puerile. Nor boring.
As for your Greek suggestions from over five years ago, you have good company in D'Imperio et al from over three decades ago.
I disagree with you, at least at this point in time, about the VMS text. As I sketched in one of the branches of this thread, I now believe that the VMS author used the text symbols IN MULTIPLE WAYS!!!, including:
1. mathematical objects, including coordinates, and simple vectors, or to say it in Ekwallese, "pointers".
2. complex ciphering, in the ordinary and long-sought-for sense.
3. decorative/artistic as per your just mentioned idea.
4. expression of un-enciphered (i.e. except for the strange VMS alphabet) speech, in more than one language, with Latin and Greek among them - Gurdjieff used to do that, and he had detailed explanations for why he considered it necessary to do that at times.
Exactly because the text is used in multiple ways, is why bulk mathematical analysis of the text yields such confusing results, and is why other methods of attack make a bit of highly exciting and promising progress only to suddenly hit a brick wall.
Imagine just the four above uses represented in the text, and an analytic attack does not pre-suppose it. The attack proceeds upon a bulk of text, without first having, with some confidence, separated the bulk into probable categories as per 1-4 above, demanding 4 separate analytic considerations. And so, key-recovery schemes and entropy calculations etc. are done on what amounts to a sample that has right from the beginning averaged out the true, and several, cover-scheme characteristics.
Berj
From: Adam McLean <>
Reply-To: vms-list@voynich.net
To: vms-list@voynich.net
Subject: RE: VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript
Date: Tue, 02 May 2006 16:37:18 +0000
>It seems Adam has, by implication, proposed a fair contest: McLain and Ekwall will translate ............
******************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : voynich-de@yahoogroups.de
Sent : Saturday, April 29, 2006 3:07 PM
To : voynich-de@yahoogroups.de
Subject : [voynich-de] Voynich Manuskript Traumforschung Experiment
Jonathan, und Gruppe
Ich habe noch mal deine web-Seite durchgelesen mit besondere Aufmerksamkeit an deiner Traumtheorie.
Nun, meine eigenen Haupttheorien bz. VM drehen sich Mathematik, Alchemy, Tempelritter, sowohl ein Paar andere Sachen herum. Aber, der moegliche Einfluss von Traumerfahrungen steht nicht unbedingt dengegen.
Es ist mir eingefallen das mann mit der Gruppe ein Experiment versuchen kann. So, zum Beispiehl:
1.) die Gruppe waehlt eine besondere Seite aus dem VM, und jeder macht eine Druck-Kopie davon. Die Seite sollte eine sein, die keiner in der Gruppe bisher viel Aufmerksamkeit gegeben hat.
2.) Eine Nacht ist bestimmt, und jeder schlaeft mit seiner Kopie unter dem Kopfkissen.
3.) Traeume waehrend der Nacht sind so schnell vie moeglich aufgeschrieben.
4.) Die Traeume sind dann zur Gruppe berichtet.
Also, es ist so etwa eine Seance. Stellt euch mal vor, welche Reaktion solch eine Idee auf der english Liste begegnen wuerde :-)
Berj
**************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : voynich-de@yahoogroups.de
Sent : Tuesday, May 9, 2006 4:32 PM
To : voynich-de@yahoogroups.de
Subject : RE: Re[2]: [voynich-de] Betrifft: Voynich Manuskript Traumforschung Experiment
Jonathan
Das f116v Bild ist gut angekommen - sehr schoen gemacht, und sehr gebrauchbar.
"Eine interessante Seite. Ich habe den Text einmal nachbearbeitet am PC und verbessert. Vielleicht sieht man jetzt mehr. Kann noch wer gut Latein? :-D"
Ich bin der Meinung das die f116v Buchstaben nicht nur Lateinische sind. Ich sehe z.b. in der fierten Zeile, fiertes Wort, was das Gr. eta aehnlich ist.
Mit Beziehung die Kreuze, hier sind zwei Briefe die Kircher geschrieben hatt, und beide haben + Kreuze ganz oben am Anfang:
http://diglib.hab.de/edoc/ed000005/comment.htm
Der Brief 28 Juli 1651 an Herzog August, BA-II-5-354 (1651-07-28)
und der Brief 31 August 1664, BA-II-5-359 (1664-08-31)
Klik auf "Quelle". Die Groessen dieser Kreuze, ~ 9 mm und 6,5 mm, sind nicht weit entfernt von die Kreuze in f116v, ~ 5 mm.
Auch interessant: in beiden Briefen wird cryptografy diskutiert. "Eine Tabelle würde ja auf einen Code hinweisen. ;-)"
Jah das habe ich auch dedacht.
"Jedenfalls hat der das Manuskript geschrieben, der F116v geschrieben hat. ............... Denn er bedankt sich bei seinem Meister für die Tore, die er ihm gezeigt hat."
Ich bin nicht ueberzeugt das der selbe der f116v schrieb, auch das ganze Buch schrieb. Und weniger noch bin ich ueberzeugt das die f116v Zeilen Tore oeffnen usw. lesen. Dieser Ansichtspunkt geht zurueck an Newbold und auch
Brumbaugh. Aber ich sehe da keine feste Beweisung. Es ist fuer mich noch nicht ausgeschlossen das es moeglich ist, das Kircher, waerend er Besitzer des VMS war, die Zeilen in f116v geschrieben hatt.
Berj
******************************
*******************************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Sunday, May 21, 2006 11:41 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : VMs: General mcP Hypothesis on the Voynich Manuscript
Hello to all:
For those who are interested, I've drafted as clearly as I presently can, an attempt, to unify into a general working hypothesis of the bigger picture of the Voynich Manuscript, the bits and pieces, like prime numbers theory, Knights Templar, and other ideas that I've been focusing on lately, also with some ideas suggested by others. Having an overview hypothesis, if it happens to be anywhere close to the truth, will better suggest developing new insights, while if it happens to be quite wrong, of course brings with it the greater risk of going down seemingly attractive, but ultimately fruitless trails. We shall one day know.
I'll here first present the draft (subject to modification to whatever degree becomes expedient, or even complete discarding) in outline form, I. - VI., and then follow it with some comments:
A GENERAL mcP HYPOTHESIS ON THE VOYNICH MANUSCRIPT
I. What is the Voynich Manuscript (VMS) ?
The Voynich manuscript is an incomplete copy of a manuscript, herein referred to as "manuscript P" (mcP). Presently, mcP is still lost.
II. What is manuscript P ?
Manuscript P, originating in early 15th century Europe, is a cryptic socio-political attack-instrument, focused on misogynysm (1) and the Roman Catholic Church.
The partial intent of mcP is sociological, in that it means to motivate a sisterhood in the proto-stage of what Robert Batchelor has described as the "Republic of Codes" (2), to counterbalance the male dominance in the proto-republic;
the other partial intent of mcP is political, in that it means to act as an indictment of, and counterforce to, the excesses of the Roman church.
III. Who was behind manuscript P ?
The mastermind of manuscript P was a woman (MmsP).
She was well educated and well-connected, especially in literary circles. MmsP conceived and began the prototype of mcP on her own, but over the years she attracted sympathetic secret collaborators, including men, and one man in particular became like a right-hand man to her, as in an older sister - younger brother relationship. With time then, the prototype mcP evolved to reflect the learning and creativity of several learned and creative collaborators, and through them tapped into ancient source material outside of Europe, especially Byzantine.
IV. What was MmsP's key conception for making mcP compelling to those of the literati, in any age from-then-on, who would come in contact with mcP?
MmsP's key idea for infusing power into mcP was: that her document, while making its anti-misogynysm and anti- Roman Church points, exhibit encyclopedic demonstrations of the best of the art of secret communications, covering a wide spectrum of literary material, and covering a display of advanced knowledge, knowledge so advanced, that from the recognition of its presence in mcP, it would guarantee mcP's place in history and continue to inspire forever a counter-misogynysm sisterhood, and a check on the Roman Church.
At an early stage of her work in progress, MmsP attracted a highly skilled mathematician as a collaborator. The most advanced knowledge exhibited in mcP is mathematical theory of prime numbers, hence the choice of "P" in the designation: mcP.
V. What was the cover-impression that MmsP intended mcP to convey?
MmsP originally designed mcP so as to have it give the casual observer the superficial impression of an allegorical eccentric medieval garden, specifically a somewhat odd, but characteristic-for-the-era debased by recopying-far-from-source, Herbal, with astrology and alchemy influences. For the purpose of covering manuscript P's secrets, the Herbal impression would make the possession of a copy of the book by cognoscenti, either man or woman, unremarkable. As mcP evolved with the participation of collaborating contributors, the cover-impression became more challenging to maintain.
VI. Throughout its history, have copies, or partial copies, of mcP been at least partly understood / read by some persons, while they, for various reasons, remained circumspect about their thoughts on it?
Very likely yes. The 17th century polymath Athanasius Kircher, S.J., is a good candidate. Possibly also, closer to us in time, are Ethel Voynich, Miss A.M. Nill, and Fr. Theodore C. Petersen. Jesuit scholars directly associated with the Villa Mondragone, near Rome, in the latter part of the 19th century, are possible candidates. All these are well known to VMS students.
COMMENTS on I. - VMS as a reflection of mcP.
The VMS is missing some pages. Therefore, even if the VMS was originally, at the time of its writing, intended to be the first, and perhaps also the unique copy of mcP, it is still only a partial reflection of mcP.
If the VMS was intended to be a unique copy of mcP, perhaps a private notebook not intended for duplication, might we then not expect more creative use of the parchment flaws? On page f15v there is the possibility that the rendering of a plant leaf may be intentionally incorporating a hole in the parchment. Also conceivably, in f116v, a hole in the parchment to the immediate left of the 2nd and 3rd text-lines may be being intentionally used to display symbols from the 3rd and 4th lines of f115v: would that remain constant over a long period of time and manuscript aging and wear and tear, if mcP was intended to be relevant for a long time to come after its writing? But overall throughout the VMS, based on the Beinecke images, I find little to suggest that the VMS was intended to be a single-copy manuscript. My guess is that mcP existed in final form, even if not gathered, and that the VMS is a later, but not too much later, copy.
COMMENTS on II. - characteristics of mcP.
A 15th c. European origin for the VMS has a great deal of support. (3)
The concept of "floral" runs throughout the Voynich manuscript. The tremendous number of so-called "nymphs", often described as plump naked ladies, but to my eye more often appearing as women with child, suggest very strongly the idea of sisterhood, of a female society. The nymphs, although naked, are rendered so as not to arouse any sexual interest, instead they make, over and over, the point that the female, rather than the male, is the more important principle in the VMS. The nymphs over and over suggest: It's a woman's world! It is women who make the world go round.
The f81r illustration symbolically suggests communications between two chapters of a sisterhood immersed in secrecy. The green water in the two tubs, as opposed to clear blue water, symbolizes secrecy. But communications between the sisterhood sub-societies, who understand their symbolism and codes, flows clearly (the connecting blue water). There may be baptismal symbolism in similar balneological VMS pages: a new sister being baptized, that is initiated, into the secret sisterhood.
I see a lot of Christianity symbolism throughout the VMS, and some of it is rather obvious.
Because I am convinced that f67v1 laments the end of the Templar Knights Order (4), mcP cannot be earlier than 1314. So far, I can't see in the VMS clear symbolism that suggests the Protestant schism of Martin Luther with his Ninety-five Theses in 1517. Therefore, until I see good evidence for otherwise, I will consider that mcP dates between 1314 and 1517. In the one possibility for Luther symbolism that I have considered most, the plant illustration of f52r, with its roots suggesting an anchor cross, a so-called crux dissimulata, I think it more likely, if indeed the symbolism is Christian, that it refers to the early period of Christianity.
In the vms-list post "Christianity symbolism in the VMS" I noted that: "everything seems to be wrapped around themes of upheaval in Christianity" (5). I have come to see the unifying thread to be an attack on the excesses of the Roman Catholic Church. It looks to me like MmsP and her collaborators see Petrine Christianity at the core of the misguided Church, and they are instead sympathetic to Gnostic, Pauline, Marcionite, and derivative Christian traditions.
The unifying Christianity symbolism is subtle in places. For example, many VMS pages contain a symbol that I will call, for lack of better terminology, a "box-cross" - its construction is a sort of geometric inversion of a "+" type cross within a square, the enclosing square having a parallel line on opposite sides of a pair of sides. This symbol occurs with variations, notably solid internal cross-arms versus hollow cross-arms. This box-cross symbol is abundantly and obviously repeated on the perimeter-band of the f67v1 cosmological diagram. Yet it also appears, quite subtly, in the illustrated f99v of the so-called pharmaceutical section: four side-by-side repetitions of it form a band of the topmost cylindrical object, on the upper left of the page. And again in the cosmological section, in the f86v nine-rosettes, it makes a subdued but apparently important appearance, - just 4 examples of it that I have been able to find there, in the lower-right rosette.
Needless to say, ant-misogynist ideas and anti- Roman Church ideas have some connections.
COMMENTS on III. - the mastermind of mcP, MmsP, and her collaborators.
The VMS projects a female mastermind in several ways.
The text on page f42v starts with the most flourished gallows symbol in the entire VMS: the flourish suggests a depiction of a woman who has given birth to two children, these two children being the text-script. The symbolism is clear: a woman wrote this, and it has a double (secret) meaning.
Although rendered with restraint, the illustration on f79v depicts one of the most powerful, if not the most powerful symbolism in the entire Voynich manuscript: a celestially-associated person blessing the text with a cross. That person is not a man, it is not a priest, it is not some Sistine Chapel -like representation of God as a bearded ancient man, but rather it is a woman.
From the point of view of the ratio: most symbolically complex-and-mysterious, versus diagrammatically simple, the illustration of f67v2 can be considered among the higher examples in the VMS. In the lower-right daughter-circle of the main circle, are 4 balloon-heads, one of which wears a cone-hat suggesting a woman. The 4 balloon heads suggest a family centered around this woman.
In the f71v zodiac "Gemini" illustration we see a woman and a man grasping each other's hands, projecting the idea of partnership. The woman appears the superior in stature and maturity. This Voynich f71v illustration ought to be, in my opinion, seriously considered as a possible portrait of the woman mastermind of the mcP, and her right-hand man.
That the female MmsP had sympathetic male collaborators is suggested by several illustrations. For example, in f70r, the so-called zodiac "Pisces" illustration, there is among all the nymphs one male, depicted as an equal participant in the gathering. (6)
Relatively, there are a few males in the VMS illustrations, but never are they seen to be in any way in a superior position with respect to the females. In a few cases there may be the suggestion of castrated male, for example the figures at top-right in f76v and f77r.
The dramatic climax of the VMS, the f86v nine-rosettes foldout, on the whole gives me the strong impression of a Byzantine mosaic.
The immediate first candidate for MmsP, and therefore the mastermind of the Voynich Manuscript, is:
Christine de Pizan (c. 1364 - 1430?). (7)
Or a disciple of hers.
If mcP was composed in Europe during Christine's day, then even if she was not MmsP, it is hard to fathom that she was not at least aware of it.
COMMENTS on IV. - MmsP's key conception of mcP.
Looking over the vast amount of work done on the VMS by highly qualified and motivated, mostly male intellects, there is this pattern: some definite and promising decoding progress is made in some portion of the VMS, only to run into a brick wall, sometimes spawning endless going-around-in-circles analytics. I conclude that some of these attacks were actually locally correct, or close to correct. Likewise, some authoritative determinations along the lines of this-and-that-is-ruled-out in the VMS, are also correct, or close to correct. Furthermore, the experimental ambiguous encoding of passages in vowel-less Indo-European language elements is also present: it provides the mcP student, courtesy of MmsP, the opportunity to see what common theme elements can be decoded from the passages when they are attacked with different Indo-European reference languages - this is a valid and creative idea, and one that I would be less surprised to hear that it came from a woman, than from a man. And, there probably are passages in msP that are actually herbal.
Thus, mcP was intentionally designed by MmsP to be a convoluted encyclopedic encoding, with all the best techniques of secret communications, and precisely calculated to throw off logic-obsessed "male thinking" by would-be male decoders, as only a brilliant and educated woman could do, when she set her mind to showing those egotistical little boys a thing or two.
MmsP understood the way men think very well, and I suspect that she was a mother and had raised at least one son. Manuscript P is MmsP's masterpiece, serving as a foundation model for female secret societies on a par with male secret societies. No one decoding scheme can reveal all of mcP without first recognizing that, and in the context of II. and III. above.
To understand and read MmsP's manuscript, the guiding rule is NOT: Is this logical?
" We reply to this objection that our doctrine in this present treatise is not addressed to men, however much they might need to be instructed."
- Christine de Pizan, Livre des trois vertus
Rather, to understand and read MmsP's manuscript the guiding rule must be: Is this acceptable or meaningful from a woman's point of view?
From the point of view of the mcP hypothesis, an attempted reading of a sub-section of mcP must first identify it as such, and then without necessary regard to decoding rules that may have proven successful with other sub-sections, devise a self-standing decoding attack, while still expecting to see in one way or another, clues that unify the sub-section with the entire mcP. The important first step then, is to identify sub-sections - these could defy logical rules for sections in a book. Trying to find one decoding scheme or philosophy , or even generally something highly consistent, that works throughout the entire mcP, is exactly what MmsP anticipated of would-be decoders, and she employed this idea as one of the traps in her masterpiece. Perhaps she even went so far as to specify missing pages, and the impression of mis-foliation. MmsP anticipated that brilliant logic-centered male minds would attempt to decode the mcP, and she set out to use male brilliance against itself.
Languages encoded in mcP are likely several, Greek and Latin most probably, but also court language, French, and also Italian, and vernaculars, I would expect.
The featuring of certain numbers across all the sections of the VMS, makes it clear that it was conceived as a unified whole. Intentionally featured, symbolically important numbers, are easy to hide with herbal-illustration steganography. Prime numbers figure heavily in the VMS, as well as some non-primes that have special symbolic significance going back to ancient times. The non-prime number 6 is especially indicated throughout the VMS, and plays a central role in the exhibit of the most advanced knowledge in the VMS: prime number theory. (8)
The world's most mysterious manuscript was conceived by a woman. It was more important to her that her book be understood by women, than by men.
COMMENTS on V. - the cover impression of mcP.
Herbs were of great interest to everybody in the time period of mcP. Everybody had gardens with herbs and they were central to ideas on health, ideas which were sometimes mixed up with astrology. Having an Herbal, or being seen writing or copying one, could not have been a very suspicious thing back then, as it is not today either. Then, as today, one could thumb through an Herbal, and see lots of unfamiliar things without becoming suspicious; and back then vague impressions of alchemy would not have been negative, but rather suggestive of learning. The parchment of the VMS is not high-grade; perhaps MmsP specified medium-grade parchment for her book as an extra measure to help secrecy.
COMMENTS on VI. - previous readers of mcP.
The idea that Kircher studied the VMS goes all the way back to Wilfrid Voynich's original revelations. Although I am not absolutely convinced that Kircher actually had contact with the VMS, I consider it very likely that he did, and I have also considered, in the Brumbaugh spirit of mad imagination (9), the possibility that Kircher made notes in the VMS during his study. (10)
In investigating more closely the thoughts of Ethel Voynich and A.M. Nill on the VMS, the correspondence of Prof. Leonell C. Strong may be of interest. (11)
Fr. Petersen studied the VMS to the end of his life, but was sparse with his personal observations about it. Why?
The Villa Mondragone, a Jesuit College, is where Voynich found the VMS in 1912.
Given that the mcP hypothesis is close to the truth, then understandably Catholic scholars who did penetrate the VMS, would have had reasons to be circumspect about it. Likewise, it would not surprise me if mcP historical research discovers a number of attempts in the past to decode mcP by famous Church antagonists, Voltaire for instance, and that because they failed, or succeeded only partially, all mention of mcP was suppressed to prevent intellectual embarrassment.
I think it is an interesting coincidence that the one indispensable book on the Voynich Manuscript, was written by a woman, Mary D'Imperio. (12)
Berj / KI3U / 17 MAY 2006
(1) by this word I mean entrenched misogynistic tendencies in some sectors of society.
(2) The Republic of Codes, Cryptographic Theory and Scientific Networks in the Seventeenth Century, Robert Batchelor, Department of History, Stanford University, November 1, 1999 [Work in Progress, Not for Citation].
This document is online here:
http://www.stanford.edu/dept/HPS/writingscience/Cryptography.html
Despite the citation disclaimer, presumably it is ok to refer to its general content, now that it has been public for so long. Batchelor is one of the few scholars who seems to appreciate telegraph language, Morse code, as a potential subject of interest in language studies. It may pay to consider telegraph language as a reference for analyzing some portions of VMS text.
(3) see vms-list archives: http://voynich.ms/
(4) vms-list posts and threads:
VMs: Voynich f67v prime numbers, de Molay & Knights Templar; April 22, 2006.
VMs: Knights Templar & f86v nine-rosettes; April 22, 2006.
VMs: Templars, Masons, and Voynich; April 23, 2006.
VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript; April 28, 2006.
(5) vms-list posts and threads:
VMs: Christianity symbolism in the VMS; May 1, 2006.
VMs: f86v clock text; May 1, 2006.
(6) vms-list post and thread: VMs: bearded man in f70r Pisces, March 31, 2006.
(7) http://home.infionline.net/~ddisse/christin.html#anchor95654
http://www.arts.auckland.ac.nz/sites/index.cfm?S=M_PIZAN
http://www.pinn.net/~sunshine/march99/pizan3.html
(8) vms-list posts and threads:
VMs: prime numbers and quadratic forms; April 17, 2006.
VMs: f58r prime numbers and & zoodiac 100; April 4, 2006.
VMs: braided prime number equations in f6r; April 4, 2006.
(9) "However, it is going to take both patience and imagination to go ahead with the next phases of study.......and an occasional injection of mad imagination. - Robert S. Brumbaugh, on the VMS, 1978.
(10) voynich-de@yahoogroups.de posts:
RE: Re[2]: [voynich-de] Betrifft: Voynich Manuskript Traumforschung Experiment; Tuesday, May 9, 2006 4:32 PM.
RE: Re[4]: [voynich-de] Betrifft: Voynich Manuskript Traumforschung Experiment; Thursday, May 11, 2006 9:20 AM
(11) http://internet.cybermesa.com/~galethog/Voynich/
(12) The Voynich Manuscript - An Elegant Enigma, M.E. D'Imperio, Aegean Park Press, ~1978, ISBN 0-89412-038-7
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From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Monday, May 22, 2006 12:47 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : VMs: Christine de Pizan
In connection with the mcP hypothesis for the Voynich ms (1), specifically the possibility that Christine de Pizan is the Lady behind it all, the MmsP, there is an interesting picture of her in the book by Frances and Joseph Gies (2).
The caption for the picture is: Woman writing at her desk (self-portrait) from the Works of Christine de Pisan (c.1364-1430).
This beautiful color picture shows Christine seated in her writing cubicle within her house, and is somewhat similar to a couple of other pictures of Christine that I have seen on the web that show her writing.
I don't know to what extent Christine controlled this "self-portrait", but it has quite a few hidden symbols in it, as well as some script symbols that are not hidden, but placed here and there in a subdued fashion.
First of interest is that she is writing in a finished and bound codex, and the script in the codex is illegible, as if out-of-focus. This seemingly innocuous detail takes on some significance when we look at the aforementioned symbols, some of which are smaller than the script elements in the codex, but are "in-focus". I think it might be possible to make out what they are by examination of the actual plate of this picture.
In particular, quite subdued, hardly noticable, blending into the folds, are what appear to be two words, on the drape that covers her writing desk, close to Christine's dress by her left leg. The dot-printing of the picture prevents me from reading these words with a magnifying glass, but I think they could be read from the original.
A well-hidden, but once seen, very unambiguous symbol, is within one of the leaves that are part of the extensive leaves-ornamentation that frame the picture. Atop the picture of Christine are 4 spiraled branches of leaves. In the second-from-left spiral, the central leaf contains a symbol that looks like an Arabic numeral 7, with a curled leg.
There is a lot more in this picture. The out-of-focus script in the codex, against the in-focus hidden symbols, suggests to me the idea of "secret writing".
Berj
(1) vms-list post: VMs: General mcP Hypothesis on the Voynich Manuscript; May 21, 2006
(2) Daily Life in Medieval Times, by Frances & Joseph Gries, 1969, 1974, 1990, Originally published by HarperCollins, Barnes & Noble edition.
***************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Monday, May 22, 2006 10:25 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net Subject : Re: VMs: Christine de Pizan
Adam McLean wrote: "I am sorry I cannot understand your methodology."
Ok then, toward understanding my methodology:
1.) I want to understand the mystery of the Voynich Manuscript.
2.) The process of exploring the VMS mystery now and then seems to require a fresh new hypothesis.
3.) I have just attempted to unify previous interesting ideas into a first draft of a fresh overview hypothesis: The VMS is derived from mcP, and MmsP conceived and oversaw the creation of mcP, with collaborators, etc. etc. etc.
4.) The mcP hypothesis suggests, actually demands, identifying candidates for MmsP.
5.) Christine de Pizan very much stands out as a candidate, to me anyway, at this very early stage of the hypothesis. In fact, exploring Christine seems to be the best way to get the fastest insight into whether or not the mcP hypothesis is at all viable.
6.) I don't know much about Christine yet, having only today ordered a couple of books on her, but it is obvious from the web that a great many people do know a lot about her, and very probably most of them are not involved with VMS research, and have no idea how burning the issue is of who conceived the world's most mysterious manuscript.
7.) On the assumption that Christine-knowledgable folks out there may have information about her that helps improve her MmsP candidacy, or helps eliminate her MmsP candidacy and thereby save further effort in that direction, lets put her name into the subject line of a VMS post that reports that there is some data suggesting she was involved with secret writing, a post that also references the post detailing the brand-new hypothesis on the VMS. vms-list posts do come to the attention of non-list members too. Directly advertising Christine via the subject-line of the post is bound to be more effective than something along the lines of "MmsP candidate blah blah blah" - I might as well put an equation in the subject line.
If you're worried about legions of Christine admirers flooding the ranks of this list, don't. As soon as anybody follows a few posts on this list they quickly get the idea of its take-no-prisoners dynamics.
Somebody out there knows something about Christine that will make her more, or less, attractive as a candidate for the Mmsp of mcP. I want that information. Unless someone is prepared to defend the charge that the mcP hypothesis is utterly irrelevant to the business of this list, it is a disservice to this list not to employ its research potential by focusing some attention on the hypothetical possibility of a connection between Christine de Pizan and the Voynich Manuscript.
Best Regards,
Berj
****************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, May 23, 2006 4:21 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Christine de Pizan
Adam McLean wrote:
"If I may summarise, your methodology is to go with your gut instinct.
You feel this person is connected to the Voynich but have no evidence at
all, just a feeling."
"Would you not be better investigating Clupea Harengus Rubea
who has often appeared in Voynich research ?"
"Take care when reading about Christine de Pizan. She is a very
attractive figure to many feminist writers and her life and background
has been extensively reconstructed by people recently who have an
agenda. One cannot rely on recent books which are often works of
rhetoric rather than scholarship."
Nah not quite gut instinct. When I named Christine de Pizan as a person of interest with respect to MmsP, I already had some clues that I'd picked up from the references I gave. Since then, thanks to an offlist communication to me, I've discovered that at least one authority, Roy Neil Graves (1), has de Pizan practicing in her writing what Deschamps and other scholars refer to as "ballade retrograde", being apparently a kind of encrypted parallel composition riding on the plain-text. Graves writes:
'...I worked backwards, in effect, to rough out the rules for what soon appeared to me to be a widespread coterie activity neither acknowledged nor publicly discussed before, except indirectly in the various speculations about whether medieval writers "hid things in their works" to entertain private readers.'
So I think that even if Christine de Pizan had nothing directly to do with the VMS, she nevertheless was prominently immersed in the traditions that brought the VMS forth, and studying her will pay dividends in unraveling the mystery.
As for gut instinct, who can do without a good amount of it in pursuing a mystery such as the VMS?
The mcP hypothesis is just exactly what I had in mind as a way to escape the swarms of Clupea Harengus Rubea, and lets go fishing in new waters.
As for the relying on anybody's books or webpages or list posts, well you just have to weigh the offerings and do the best you can. By the way, the books I ordered are not recent. Everybody has an agenda or agendas. One of your agendas shows up once in a while in bright neon lights at the bottom of your posts. I don't mind.
I'm not too keen on the term "feminist" here - I think that is a media-invented or at least media-popularized trigger-word that often mischaracterizes a lot of women's dignified concerns by implying radical male antagonism. So far, I don't get anything like that from Christine de Pizan. Look at the quote of hers I had in the mcP post (2). Perhaps she is poetically condescending toward men, but she is not radically antagonistic toward men. I think she, rightly, will not accept anything less than equal dignity accorded to women, is her attitude.
Now, as for its authorship, 94 years of research into the Voynich manuscript has proceeded primarily on the assumption that it is male. It cannot, at this stage, be unreasonable to start taking a serious look at possible female authorship. If there be red herrings there, then at least they'll be a new school of them.
Berj
(1) http://www.utm.edu/staff/ngraves/shakespeare/PearlRune.htm
(2) vms-list post: VMs: General mcP Hypothesis on the Voynich Manuscript; May 21, 2006.
*********************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, May 23, 2006 11:53 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Christine de Pizan
Nick Pelling wrote:
Hi Berj,
At 16:21 23/05/2006 -0400, Berj N. Ensanian wrote:
Now, as for its authorship, 94 years of research into the Voynich manuscript has proceeded primarily on the assumption that it is male. It cannot, at this stage, be unreasonable to start taking a serious look at possible female authorship. If there be red herrings there, then at least they'll be a new school of them.
Plenty of people have thought (and posted) about possible female authorship over the years, myself included - a few years back, I was looking at the similarities between Catarina Sforza's "Experimenti" and the VMs recipe section. Many other names have been proposed, too.
Cheers, .....Nick Pelling.....
Hello Nick
Well I myself said a couple of months ago:
"...I think it is not in-conceivable that a woman had a hand in the authorship of the VMS. In the archives Stolfi seems to consider the possibility more than casually. It would be useful to have a list of pros and cons regarding possible authorship by a woman or women." (1)
And I repeated the call for a list of pros and cons after that post.
Before making that statement I had combed the archives, and the web in general, to see if anyone was really pursuing possible female authorship. Of course I already knew what some opinions were, c.1980, on Hildegarde of Bingen, from reading D'Imperio. My searching didn't find much. For example, here is what I found in the archives posted by you (2) :
"FWIW, I think that the VMS' source traditions are likely to be similar to those of Catarina Sforza's "Experimenti" and of Gasparinus de Bripio's 1464 herbal (both of which I'd classify as empiric-spagyric)."
Now, it isn't easy to specifically search for examples where women, in general, have been considered as possible VMS authors or sources. You do the best you can with search keywords and key phrases, and read through mountains of stuff. If I suspected Catarina Sforza, I could make her name key-words. But what if I didn't suspect her, and she was in fact extensively considered by someone, but the presentation was such so as to be void of plain statements like "This vms-list post will consider Catarina Sforza, a female, a woman of the 15th century, as a possible author or source of the VMS." I could wind up missing that.
This underscores the utility of having a list of pros and cons for female / woman authorship of the VMS. Specific names, like Hildegarde, Catarina Sforza, and Christine de Pizan could be added to that, along with spelling variations, and have that all concentrated in one easy to find compilation. Moreover, having all that female-specific information together, might cause new insights to be seen, and such insights might even be of the kind that weakens the case for female authorship.
Now it seems to me that this compilation could compile itself: perhaps by assigning code designations, like PMAVMS, or PFAVMS, standing for possible male author VMS, and possible female author VMS, written somewhere in the list post by the poster. Then the list and archives software, finding those codes in a post, could index the post to the compilation. Just a thought, as the saying goes.
But presently, from what I know of about VMS efforts since the beginning, I see nothing that refutes my statement:
"Now, as for its authorship, 94 years of research into the Voynich manuscript has proceeded primarily on the assumption that it is male."
Nick, I don't think the possibility of female VMS authorship has been considered on an equal footing with the male possibility, and also, I have not seen that it has been demonstrated as reasonably improbable.
But more importantly, I am advancing for Voynich hypothesis consideration, Christine de Pizan, not just because she is a woman and I have more and more begun to see the VMS reflecting a female origin, but because I now see the origin of the VMS residing in a mastermind who coordinated collaborators. There is a big difference between just an author, and a mastermind - a mastermind has to be not just creative and educated, but also admired and followed, and in this case men as well as women following the leadership of a woman, if the core idea is correct. Back then, what woman had such powers?
Caterina certainly was a political mastermind with men and women followers, but her literary production, measured by the complexity of the VMS, makes a weak case, in my opinion. And understandably: going from one hairraising bloody ordeal to the next, when would she have had the time to coordinate something as complicated as the VMS? Presently I feel, that Christine de Pizan is the immediate first candidate for the mastermind behind it all: the MmsP of the mcP. I certainly think Christine deserves at least equal consideration with Caterina, from what I know of their histories at this point.
Now it occurred to me since writing the original post, that this mcP hypothesis can be made more flexible by allowing the possibility that MmsP's manuscript P, eventually to be reflected in the Voynich manuscript, was finalized by collaborators and followers, only some time after MmsP's death. In which case, consistent with what I had outlined, a man, namely MmsP's younger right-hand man, might have brought the mcP project to completion.
Your post on Caterina actually does not conflict with the mcP hypothesis, nor the possibility that MmsP = Christine de Pizan. Both women inherited some common literary traditions, Caterina being born a generation after Christine's death.
Suppose it turns out that Caterina too was involved in Christine's masterpiece?
Berj
(1) vms-list post: Re: VMs: prime number equations in f6r; March 29, 2006.
(2) vms-list post: VMs: Alchemical / MY Version; October 27, 2003.
*****************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net Sent : Thursday, May 25, 2006 11:22 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net Subject : Re: VMs: Christine de Pizan
About M.E. D'Imperio, Adam McLean wrote May 25, 2006 3:24 PM:
"Well that may have been her view, but it does not seem to have lead us any further towards grasping the nature of the Voynich manuscript."
Who is the "us" you are referring to Adam?
I value Mary D'Imperio's opinion on the Voynich manuscript highly. Her Elegant Enigma book has in its Bibliography two hundred sixty-seven (267) entries.
And as you presumably know, D'Imperio's book has an entire chapter devoted to Early Herbals and Materia Medica.
Here's a quote attributed to the founder and owner of this vms-list:
"...Mary D'Imperio, author of The Voynich Manuscript: An Elegant Enigma (1978), [is] the most detailed and scholarly study to date of this document (reprint available from Aegean Park Press). It uses Prescott Currier's notation, which is described in her monograph." - Jim Gillogly (1,2)
And here is an opinion on D'Imperio's book from someone well known to old timers on this list, John Baez:
"This is essential reading for anyone seriously interested in the Voynich, and those who fail to read are doomed to repeat her work." (3)
Adam, my use of the term "Voynich cognoscenti" was meant to be an efficient two-word conveying of part of the idea expressed in the outline of the mcP hypothesis, specifically:
the manuscript is intended to be understood by a secret sisterhood and their male sympathizers - the cognoscenti, and it is intended to be mis-understood by everyone else.
Now, lately you have been doing some admirable digging and again you have been using the f84r illustration, it's top third only, to make your case on the VMS, which essentially seems to be that the VMS conception is something more or less ordinary, rendered by an ashamed, ability-lacking imitator. And because I see it very oppositely, and because you are again pointing to f84r for justification of your view, I'll give you a brief, preliminary interpretation of the entire f84r illustration from the mcP hypothesis point of view:
The secret sisterhood can gather without suspicion in "communal baths". The secret doctrine is received from above, that is from the teachings of the mcP, and is interpreted and taught to the sisters by the leading lady in the local sisterhood chapter - the sisters are bathed in the doctrine, that is the truths of the sisterhood.
The doctrine flows clearly between chapters because they understand its code.
The end result is an enlightened sisterhood, with each sisterhood chapter able to carry and transmit the doctrine into the future.
The possibility that Christine de Pizan is the mastermind behind the Voynich manuscript, or one of her disciples is, is no simple matter to be dismissed lightly. Some very respected scholars are in recent years looking more closely into the art of secret communications toward the end of the medieval times, with the view that the art was far more highly developed than has been previously realized. To not take a serious look at Christine de Pizan, she the creator and publisher of The Book of the City of Ladies, in connection with the Voynich manuscript, if for no other reason than to establish her non-relevance, is an attitude that makes no sense, in my opinion.
Berj
(1) http://www.skepticfiles.org/mys5/voynich.htm
(2) http://www.meta-religion.com/Esoterism/Alchemy/the_voynich_manuscript.htm
(3) http://www.skepticfiles.org/mys5/voynichb.htm
*****************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Saturday, May 27, 2006 3:01 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : VMs: gallows letters in Christine de Pizan's work
Here is some data in connection with the idea that Christine de Pizan may be the mastermind, or the inspiration of the mastermind, behind the Voynich Manuscript. (1,2)
From this url: http://www.pizan.lib.ed.ac.uk/output.html
you can download the ~ 2.5 Mb file: morauxnov05.pdf
which is a paper by Christine de Pizan scholar, Christine Reno, of Vassar College.
Reno's paper includes 3 pictures of BL Harley MS 4431, considered one of the best copies from Christine de Pizan's workshop.
Take a look at the full page reproduction of f. 261v - it is the 3rd of the 3 pictures in the paper. The .pdf allows pretty good magnification.
In the right-side text column, note the first letter in the 2nd line. It appears as a stylishly executed gallows letter, similar to Voynich transcription symbol GC-k. (3)
Berj
(1) vms-list post: VMs: General mcP Hypothesis on the Voynich Manuscript; May 21, 2006.
(2) vms-list post: VMs: Christine de Pizan; May 22, 2006.
(3) In VMS text script jargon, "gallows" letters are the tall ones that give the impression of being capital letters; they are characteristic of the VMS.
The GC system of transcribing Voynich manuscript text symbols is a more recent system than the well-known EVA system. It is described here: http://internet.cybermesa.com/~galethog/Voynich/
That website is devoted to a hypothesis on the VMS that advances the work of Yale Univ. Prof. L.C. Strong.
****************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Monday, May 29, 2006 1:05 AM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: gallows letters in Christine de Pizan's work
Hello Keith
Yes it sure is a beauty.
You wrote Saturday, May 27, 2006 4:35 PM:
".... I don't see a gallows character, but the letter r mid-word looks familiar. I read our cz character as er, as I have pointed out previously. Also the uv in mauvais are virtually identical. We may have similar difficulty. Have you a transcription?"
Let me see if I can explain how and why I take the first symbol, 2nd line, right text column, f. 261v, of Christine's BL Harley MS 4431, to qualify as a so-called "gallows" letter. This letter in MS 4431 starts the second line of the 3rd enseignement of Christine's work: Les Enseignemens moraux. In the previously cited (in the launch post of this thread) paper, morauxnov05.pdf, there is a brief discussion about the manuscript peculiarities (parchment etc.) that this 3rd enseignement has associated with it. To qualify Christine's symbol as a gallows, I must begin with gallows in the VMS, and I caution that these are my views and perceptions of gallows, and I do not speak for the Voynich community at large.
The problem of identifying in the VMS text, if that is what it is, its "alphabet", is compounded by the likelihood of more than one scribe. The early famous Voynich researcher, Prescott Currier, identified two hands in the text, and these are commonly known as the Currier A and B hands. (1)
Conceivably, the two hands are the same scribe across a period spanning early youth and maturity, or spanning some debilitation affecting manual dexterity. I've read speculation of well more than two scribes, and I myself believe that the VMS text script exhibits more than two hands. (I also tend toward the belief that at least two illustrators were involved; I am not sure if text scribes and illustrators overlapped in the same persons. And, if several people were in fact involved in producing the VMS, then the idea that a secret society was involved is bolstered.)
Some of the tall letters in the VMS, notably 4 of them, stand out, even against other more or less equally tall letters, giving the appearance of being special, of being capital letters even when used in the middle of "words". In her book, D'Imperio, when she talks about the rare 4-times repetition of 17 symbols in the circular band of f57r (2), calls these 4 outstanding tall letters "looped symbols". The looped symbols have since then been commonly referred to as "gallows", especially here in this vms-list forum.
The gallows are rendered with quite a bit of variety throughout the estimated quarter million text symbols in the VMS. They also often exhibit a special relationship with another VMS text symbol that resembles a common "c", and this will also figure in my developing explanation of Christine's gallows. A gallows letter can be connected to a c-symbol from its left, or its right, with a horizontal bar at the top of the c-symbol. Often a pair of c-symbols are connected by such a bar, and this is seen as a text symbol in its own right, GC-1. And, a gallows is often found planted in the middle of a GC-1. And even more, there are further varieties involving gallows, that are rarer. A gallows that is connected to a c-symbol, especially when it is planted in the middle of a connected pair, is commonly known as an "intruding" gallows. Some of these intruding gallows figure heavily in many people's perceptions of the intrinsic beauty of the VMS text.
I have not seen extremely precise definitions of gallows and intruding gallows, as that would be very difficult given the varieties, so I think that some familiarity with the Voynich world is necessary to know what is meant by gallows. In my own work, I have two detailed conceptions of them. In VMS sections where I suspect Christianity themes, my conceptions of gallows letters / symbols are described in a vms-list conversation with Steve Ekwall (3).
My other conception of gallows is the one I rely on for seeing as such, Christine's gallows symbol. I combine considerations from two starting points for this conception: pen strokes in the formation of script symbols, and qualitative (no calculations) mathematical perspectives.
Script symbols can be analyzed according to how it is believed a scribe's pen strokes must go, in order to have a script symbol example fall into the class that defines a particular script symbol. Naturally, complications can arise with respect to left and right handed scribes, and scripting direction (if it happens to be alternating, i.e. boustrophedon). In my view, the VMS was written, or substantially written anyway, by right handers as linear left-to-right script, so I avoid that complication like that. If I remember correctly, there is in the vms-list archives here and there good discussion of the text symbols with respect to their pen strokes. What I'm writing you here adds to that, hopefully intelligently.
Qualitative mathematical perspectives can be dramatized by appreciating the introductory discussions on the "topological equivalence" of the donut and the coffee mug. No calculating is necessary for a qualitative appreciation. In the branch of math, "topology", which is deeply linked with geometry, we have in elementary topology that the generic donut and the generic coffee mug are equivalent objects. Yes. Because, a soft unbaked donut, or a soft unfired mug, insofar as concerns the shape, can be worked or deformed into the other, without cutting the material or punching holes into it, or closing up existing holes. This idea, once firmly rooted in the mind, has a tremendously positive effect on the mind that is moving through the world encountering mysteries that it's curiosity is aroused by. (4)
The above idea of an invariant aspect despite deformations, plus symmetry and anti-symmetry, also considered qualitatively, are what I have in mind, along with pen strokes, for recognizing gallows, or looped symbols. So let me now accordingly give the definition for one of the gallows, as I have it in mind, when I do Voynich work. It's very simple. The gallows I define is of course the one that I see Christine exhibiting.
On the script line I stand up an imaginary Latin cross - it has no symbolism attached to it, but rather serves as a geometric reference for both vertical and horizontal symmetry and anti-symmetry. The tip of my pen I place on the script-line, a little to the left of the invisible cross's upright bar. I write upwards until I have surpassed the cross's horizontal bar. Then my writing begins a counter-clockwise curve, that eventually arcs back across the already written ascender. Completing the left loop, with the curvature now relaxed some, I am tracing across the cross's imaginary upright. The counter-clockwise arcing of my pen continues, I tighten the curvature a bit, and close its trace with a second, the right side loop, and then I relax the curving again so that the trace proceeds downward toward the script-line, and to the right of the imaginary cross's upright. Were this done with perfection, I would see a symbol that is symmetric about a middle imaginary vertical axis.
A nice example of this symbol in the VMS can be seen in the top part of the illustration on page f84r: near the top-right of the page, above the 2nd from right bathing VMS sister, is a word, and have a look at the word's 2nd symbol.
GC, with his transcription system, has transcribed this symbol as "k", GC-k as I refer to it here, or GC-107. That he has so transcribed it, can be seen from his transcription tables (he calls them "Voynich Keyboard Assignments"), and by checking his grand transcript of the entire VMS (he calls it "Voynich Release 1.01"). (5)
That entire Voynich word in f84r, GC transcribes as "okoe9".
GC also included in his tables some variations on GC-107: GC-150, GC-242, and GC-244. But there are many variations in the VMS of course. Have a look, for example, at the starting text symbol on Voynich page f47r. In his transcription, GC assigns GC-g to that symbol. I do not agree with that, as I believe that that symbol represents the creative ligaturing of two separate symbols, or perhaps even a unique symbol in its own right. But my differing opinion just reflects the problems faced in doing transcriptions. We want a transcription to organize the quarter million symbols into an alphabet sized table, but we wind up throwing away what could be critical information from the text. GC might be right about GC-g in that instance: he may have had a strong gut feel about that symbol based on things he saw during his transcribing of the VMS.
Likewise, my simple tracing-around-an-imaginary-cross definition for that gallows symbol must be made flexible for the many variations of that "basic" gallows symbol. The loops can be unequal in size, even so narrow as to not appear like they have holes, the two legs can be unequal, and so on. In particular, many of those gallows in the VMS have the left loop as triangular shaped, and I think there is symbolic significance to that (3). Also, there are situations, as I know from my own handwriting, where I may render a symbol with other than my normal pen tracing, even though I am thinking and intending the usual case.
But, with my definition for that gallows as per above, I have in mind a basic pattern. Variations on it may be thought of as subclasses in the basic class. Have a look at a few Voynich gallows that I consider to fall into the class I have just defined:
f84v : last line of the 1st paragraph, 1st symbol
f79r : the 17th line counting up from the bottom, the 9th last symbol in the line.
f112r: line 26 (line 27 is at the 6th star down), 1st symbol. Also compare it with the 1st symbol in line 25 directly above it.
There are many other such symbols throughout the VMS, gallows where the right hand loop is constricted. But they, and these three examples, all share with the nice gallows of f84r, the essentials of the definition I gave above.
And so does Christine's gallows. If we saw it exactly like that in the VMS we'd have it as just another variation. There is still, in Christine's gallows, to consider the extended curl that is contiguous with the bottom end of the gallows's left leg. Perhaps it is just a flourish, but perhaps also it is a variation like GC-150.
We don't yet know, or have a consenus on, what this basic gallows symbol means in the Voynich manuscript. As to what it means in Christine's manuscript, we can turn to authorities who have read MS 4431 and have transcribed it. According to the Christine de Pizan Database (6), the line this gallows starts with, reads:
Aprens a congnoistre le monde
Therefore it is indicated that Christine's gallows symbol, in MS 4431 representing French, means the letter: A.
But, it appears that Christine was keen on hiding parallel writing in her works:
"For Christine, poetry had at least two levels of meaning, one apparent and another, or perhaps even several others, hidden under the ornamentation of language."
"She defined it in these terms [in Fais et Bonnes Meurs]: 'The word poetry is taken to mean either some fiction used for the narration as a whole, or the introduction of something which signifies one thing on the surface, but has one or more hidden meanings, or, one might better say, poetry's object is truth and its technique is doctrine clothed in ornamental words and suitable nuances.' " (7)
So therefore, the available interpretation of what Christine's gallows means in HM4431, f. 261v, isn't necessarily a shut and closed case.
This all may seem long-winded, and maybe it is, but it accurately describes how and why, the instant I saw Christine's MS 4431 symbol, I recognized it as a "gallows".
Lastly, I noted from your recent posts, which are in the vms-list archives, in particular (8), that very soon after you had begun to study the Voynich manuscript, you reached the conclusion that women were central to its origin. In my own case, it took me several years to realize that firmly. I think it would be interesting to know how it was that you so rapidly formed that conclusion. In my own case I had many hints all along, and of course I knew from D'Imperio's book and the vms-list archives, that now and then the possibility would be relatively briefly considered. As my suspicions became stronger, fairly recently in time, I decided to try something: rather than copying VMS text script down freely, I forced myself to write it into a space that matched the dimensions of the source text. Then I thought about the way the VMS text flows so naturally, as if written by someone writing a letter, and how SMALL it is. The necessary manual dexterity seemed to me more indicative of a woman scribe. That launched me into considering all the other indicators of femininity in the VMS in a unified view. And that's when a lot of things about this mystery started to make sense.
Long before I ever had the first thought about Christine de Pizan possibly being involved with the Voynich manuscript origin, when I was trying to visualize how the physical VMS came about, I thought that it could have been an early product of a start-up scriptorium in a convent of nuns. I still come back to that thought regularly, although I think that the cosmological illustrations have also a male hand in them.
Berj / KI3U
P.S. I have an off-thread comment on something you posted, below [9].
(1)The Voynich Manuscript- An Elegant Enigma, by M.E. D'Imperio, Aegean Park Press, ~1980, ISBN 0-89412-038-7
(2) That page is today identified as f57v. This points out another problem for VMS newcomers: not all pages in the VMS have been identified consistently in the literature, throughout VMS study history, for various reasons. I tend to use the page identifiers of the Yale University Beinecke Library (which has owned the VMS since 1960).
(3) vms-list post: RE: VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript; Monday, May 1, 2006 10:13 PM.
(4) Some of the most astounding results in mathematics, that are readily appreciated qualitatively by anyone interested, and appreciated without any calculations, are in the mathematical theory of knots and braids.
(5) http://internet.cybermesa.com/~galethog/Voynich/
(6) http://www.arts.ed.ac.uk/french/christine/cpstart.htm
(7) Christine de Pizan, Her Life and Works, A Biography by Charity Cannon Willard, New York, Persea Books, 1984.
(8) vms-list post by Kbody: VMs: Odd VMs Page Again; Sun May 14, 2006 11:46 pm.
[9] I'll take this opportunity to say that I also like your idea expressed in:
vms-list post by Kbody: VMs: Consistency; Fri May 19, 2006 11:41 pm.
When I was doing a lot of hex machine and assembly language coding in the 1980's it became after a while natural to think of the code in pronounceable words in my mind, while also understanding the algorithms being carried. It was a temporary pronounceable "language" that just came effortlessly into my mind from nowhere, and just as quickly faded away after I got away from nonstop computer programming. I found out that a friend of mine who earns his living programming, also had this experience, when I walked in on him one day as he was programming directly in hex and rapidly speaking to himself this strange sounding language. Before then, for some odd reason, I had assumed that it was just a peculiarity of mine. Nowadays, involved with Voynich research, I wish I had had a tape recorder running back then, so I could listen to what my computer code language speech, talking to myself while programming, sounded like, and compare it with the actual code script. By far the most interesting parts of that pronouceable speech for Voynich work would be, I have to believe, the programming sessions concerned with synchronized-branches true real-time procedures, and self-modifying code, requiring in mind a table of machine instruction cycles counts. Unless I was in the midst of doing that again, I would have a real hard time designing such a pronounceable and dictate-able language from scratch. But how interesting it would be to use such as a reference for analyzing the Voynich text!
*********************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, May 30, 2006 2:40 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : RE: VMs: Transcription of the recipe stars
> Hi all,
> I've taken the liberty of compiling a small transcription for the stars in the recipe section:
> # transcription of the stars found in the voynich recipe section
> # compiled 2006 by elmar vogt --
> #
> # "-" indicates a hollow star,
> # "o" indicates a star with a dot in the center
> # "X" indicates a "massive" star (completely filled)
> #
> X--X-X--X--X-X--X-- # f 103r
> o-o-o-o-o-o-o- # f 103v
> X-XX-X-X-o-o- # f 104r
> o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 104v
> 1o-o-o-o-o # f 105r
> o-o-o-o-o- # f 105v
> o-2o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 106r
> -o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 106v
> o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 107r
> o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 107v
> --X--oX--X-X---X # f 108r
> o-o-o-o--o-o-o-o # f 108v
> # f 109r missing
> # f 109v missing
> # f 110r missing
> # f 110v missing
> o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 111r
> o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 111v
> o-o-o-o-o-o- # f 112r
> o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 112v
> -o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 113r
> o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 113v
> o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 114r
> -o-o-o-o-o-o # f 114v
> o-o-oo-o-o-o- # f 115r
> o-o-o-o-o-o-o # f 115v
> -o-o-o-o-o # f 116r
> #
> # notes:
> # 1 -- f 105r: not sure if the first star is supposed to be part
> # of the sequence
> # 2 -- f 106r: star marked "?" is very small
> # both questionable stars are of the "o"-type (center dot)
> I was quite astounded to find that most of the pages only consist of alternating patterns, and that the massive stars are > limited to three pages.
> While transcribing the stars in their sequence is fairly straightforward, I wouldn't really know how to do that with the > astrological stars. We don't know if the circles are supposed to be read inside out or the other way around, and we > don't know where the starting position of each circle is (provided they're meant to be read in sequence at all).
> I'm open for suggestions, but judging from the current picture (and from the fact that the recipe stars don't seem well > aligned with text lines and paragraphs), my best bet would be they're purely ornamental.
> Cheers,
> Elmar
> Elmar Vogt / Königswarterstr. 18 / 90762 Fürth / GERMANY
> / beamends.pbwiki.com / Tel.: (++49/0)173-591 2993
Elmar
Do you see any significance to some of the stars being connected by tails, and can you modify your stars transcription system to indicate connections?
Berj
************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, May 30, 2006 5:09 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Transcription of the recipe stars
Elmar wrote Tue, 30 May 2006 22:37:29 +0200 :
"At a first glance, there seem to be all kinds of "tails", starting with stars which have one ray a bit longer than the rest to those which have really pronounced tails in the form of a thin line. When they touch each other, it seems to me to be merely coincidental, rather than indicating a connection between the stars.
I've currently got no idea how those differing lengths could be meaningfully encoded in a transcription?"
Well, I was looking at your transcript and doing some impressing of possible number sequences on it.
For example, your transcript:
X - - X - X - - X - - X - X - - X - - # f 103r
I transformed that into this:
1 2 1 1 1 2 1 2 1 1 1 2 1 2
That sequence would of course change with the addition of the star-tails connections information.
Not sure if it will lead to an integer sequence that will suddenly wow-pop eyeballs 8-0
Berj
*************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, May 30, 2006 5:31 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Transcription of the recipe stars
Plugging that sequence (minus the 1st term as reccomended) into:
http://www.research.att.com/~njas/sequences/
We get the full details for:
A111616 n divided by the third upper diagonal of the array in A111615.
Berj
From: "Berj N. Ensanian" <> Reply-To: vms-list@voynich.net
To: vms-list@voynich.net Subject: Re: VMs: Transcription of the recipe stars
Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 17:09:33 -0400
Elmar wrote Tue, 30 May 2006 22:37:29 +0200
"At a first glance, there seem to be all kinds of "tails", starting with stars which ............."
*************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, May 30, 2006 6:47 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Transcription of the recipe stars
The related sequences of this one from f103r (ignoring star-tails):
A111616: 2,1,1,1,2,1,2,1,1,1,2,1,2 include:
A113120 a(n) = smallest number of syllables necessary to communicate n by phone, in French.
A114116 1's-counting matrix: row sums give number of 1's in binary expansion of n+1.
A062557 2n-1 1's followed by a 2.
The last one certainly seems simple enough for VMS era mathematics.
And its Pin plot graph look like it could be used to select text from a body of text easily enough.
Berj
***************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Wednesday, May 31, 2006 12:43 AM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: gallows letters in Christine de Pizan's work
Keith
You wrote Monday, May 29, 2006 5:47 PM:
"I have never tried writing with a goose quill on roughish vellum, but I suspect upward strokes are best avoided, especially for a left handed scribe. The first stroke clearly is written downwards, allowing the character to be either eva t or k. Then resumed from the top."
I've never tried it either. And, it sure would be good to have on-board here someone who has done a lot of parchment scripting to give us their view on the strokes in the VMS. But anyway, prompted by your comments, I again looked at page f84r, at the socalled "ZOOM" high resolution .sid image of it from the Beinecke. I saw some new things I had not noticed before.
First, looking at the gallows letter we are discussing, i.e. the 2nd letter in the word above the bathing sister, who is the second sister from the right, at the top third of the page illustration: I agree that the scribe formed the left vertical independently of the rest of the symbol. But I am not so sure that the stroke proceeded from top toward bottom.
I did some experiments writing that entire word, with three different pens, on two different sheets of paper, one of them being fake parchment. I am right-handed. And I examined the results with a x10 eye-loop.
The first immediate result is that the fake parchment is definitely more telling than the 20 pound ordinary copy paper I use in my printer. With these very limited experiments, in my hand, I found that better than 50% of the time, but not too much more of the time, the start of a stroke, where the pen impacts the paper, is somewhat heavier than the end of that stroke, where the pen leaves the paper. I was expecting something closer to 100%, but it could be because it was a conscious experiment, rather than my ordinary writing. But, checking my ordinary writing, on ordinary paper, I found pretty much the same. This is certainly something that would need a lot more study for reliable conclusions I would think.
Looking over that gallows letter, in the .sid image, I just can't make up my mind if the stroke that made the left vertical, was written from top to bottom, as you see it, or from bottom to top. For me, it is not "clearly" from top to bottom.
A SCRIBAL CORRECTION, OR A CIPHER SCHEME ?
And then a surprise: the .sid image strongly suggests, to me anyway, that that symbol started out as a definite GC-251 gallows, and then the scribe added a loop to its near-top left to make it a GC-107 (GC-k) gallows! I had missed that completely when viewing the x8 resolution image, and even with the .sid image it took me a few minutes of study to actually notice it, during the studying of its strokes.
So: I wonder if that "correction" is a true correction, or if it is yet another trick in the cipher system of the Voynich / mcP ? What I mean is, is it possible that the decipherer is supposed to look for apparently corrected symbols, and then take as the true symbols, their uncorrected renderings? In the above that would mean taking that symbol to be GC-251, rather than GC-107, which is what it plainly looks like.
If so, one shudders to think what all sorts of conclusions have been built up on the VMS text, that may have to be quite revised.
A HIDDEN MIRRORED-P GALLOWS ?
And then yet another surprise! Have a look at the 2nd word in the 4th last line - the 4th line up from the bottom of the page. The "2nd symbol", to casual observation, appears as just another example of the symmetric gallows letter we are discussing. GC had transcribed it as GC-k, and years before Takahashi had transcribed as EVA-t, which are equivalent, and indicate the symmetric gallows symbol. (1)
But perhaps it isn't! Perhaps it is actually 2 symbols! At high zoom in, the .sid seems to show quite clearly that the expected horizontal stroke was never executed, nor even attempted - the parchment shows no signs of scuffing or faded ink traces that I can discern. I am far from an expert in how inks fade on parchment. But what I see there, is two side by side symbols, the right one looking like a p, or Greek rho, and the left looking similar to a mirror image.
So far as I can tell, neither symbol appears in the GC transcription alphabet, nor in the older EVA alphabet. And small wonder - when we look at f84r, not magnified, but in its natural size, it is only the sharpest and deliberate concentration that would notice this.
If indeed these are two originally separate symbols, rendered to fool the eye into seeing just one symbol, then what does this mean? How much revising of trancriptions is necessary, and what will be the effect on previous conclusions about the VMS text? While it would certainly make for a lot of new excitement and discovery, it seems to me that it would be preferable if these hidden / incognito symbols are rare, thus preserving previous work. But they must have some special meaning if they are, as appears to me to be the case here, fooling the casual observer intentionally. In outlining the mcP hypothesis (2), in COMMENTS on IV., I wrote:
"The important first step then, is to identify sub-sections - these could defy logical rules."
Conceivably, this hidden mirrored-p symbol, or whatever name it eventually gets, and other incognito symbols that may be found, are section markers: the text between them adheres to its own cipher system, which can be very different from the ciphers in adjacent sections, even though the appearance of the syntax doesn't change much across sections.
THE COLORS
You wrote:
"I don't understand why her red and blue ink is in such bad condition. The green in the bathing scenes was intended to be blue, but the ink would not spread. Blue generally implies water."
I believe the green is intended to be green. (3)
Have a look at the middle part of the f84r illustration. Counting from left to right, there are 10 bathing sisters, and for convenience I am numbering the right-facing ones after the sisters they are standing behind. Compare sisters 1, 4, 7, and 8. Specifically, look at the area inbetween their left arm and body. With sisters 4 and 8, it is green as we expect. With sister 7 it is uncolored, which might not mean much, since lots of old manuscripts have unfinished artwork. But with sister 1, the color is tan-yellow.
This again make me think that the symbolic aspects are more important than the
condition of the inks.
THE LADY SCRIBE
You wrote: "I also think she was in terminal decline."
Now, if Lady Scribe was in terminal decline, wouldn't her eyesight be poor? How did she manage to flow all that script so nicely in such a small space?
Berj / KI3U
(1) Takahashi's website provides several very useful VMS study tools, including his entire EVA-alphabet transcription:
http://www.voynich.com/
(2) vms-list post: VMs: General mcP Hypothesis on the Voynich Manuscript; May 21, 2006.
(3) see COMMENTS on II. in reference (2).
****************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Saturday, June 3, 2006 1:01 AM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : VMs: the clock "hands" in f86v nine-rosettes
Hello all,
I've got some new data on the so-called "clock" in the Voynich nine-rosettes fold-out, i.e f86v.
I've analyzed this clock before (1,2), focusing attention on its "hands", meaning the L-like structure in the middle of it.
I've found a drawing strikingly similar to it in an Italian manuscript dated 18 November 1469:
http://www.smu.edu/bridwell/SpecialCollections/online_exhibits/MS5f1rWM.jpg
You can see it right away, rendered in red ink, at the bottom right of the ms page exhibited. The magnified resolution is quite good.
The link just given comes from a wonderful treasure trove of Bridwell Library mss data:
http://www.smu.edu/bridwell/SpecialCollections/online_exhibits/brms.htm
where they have this to say about this manuscript:
"Author: Pseudo-Eusebius of Cremona and Pseudo-Augustine.
Title: Epistola ad Damasum et Theodorum Senatorem de morte Hieronimi. Bound with: In vita Hieronimi presbiteri and Pseudo-Augustine. De admonitione ad comitem Aurelianum.
Origin: [Italy], 18 November 1469.
Description: Manuscript on paper. 86 leaves. 21.4 x 14.5 cm. Single column of 27 lines. Textblock: 15 x 9 cm.
Binding: Bound by Sir Edward Sullivan in green Levant morocco inlaid with red, pale green, and cream morocco and richly gilt with flowers and leaves. Signed on pallet "E.S. Aurifex" [Sir Edward Sullivan].
Comments: Written in an amateur legal hand by Crisogonus de Nassis, son of Raphael de Nassis. The Pseudo-Eusebian letter to Pope Damasus and the Senator Theodore, describing St. Jerome's death (BHL 3866; Cavallera II, 144-145), probably dates from the twelfth century and is possibly Cistercian.
Bound with: In vita Hieronimi presbiteri and Pseudo-Augustine. De admonitione ad comitem Aurelianum, also copied by Crisogonus de Nassis, 10 December 1469. The second work, the Life of St. Jerome (BHL 873; Cavallera II, 143-144) is a series of biographical notices on St. Jerome compiled by the twelfth-century Cistercian Nicholas Maniacoria. Scribe: Crisogonus de Nassis.
Decoration: Rubricated throughout.
Folio 1r has red ornamental initial and the coat of arms of Crisogonus de Nassis painted in red and black, with the initials "CN".
Provenance: (1) Crisogonus de Nassis, 1469-? (2) Library of Sir Edward Sullivan, c. 1900. (3) Library of H.J.B. Clements, Esq., Killadoon, Kildare County. (4) Sold by Colonel H.T.W. Clements at Sotheby's (London), 1 November 1966, Lot 1131 (5) Purchased by Thorp. (6) Sold by Colin & Charlotte Franklin (Culham, near Oxford) to Bridwell Library, July, 1985."
It's nice to have a scribe's name.
There is a c. 1150 Byzantine ms in Greek to look at also, for some interesting things, in particular the spacing of the "+" like crosses, that are reminiscent of the text on Voynich f116v.
Berj / KI3U
(1) vms-list post: VMs: Christianity symbolism in the VMS; Monday, May 1, 2006 10:11 AM.
(2) vms-list post: VMs: f86v clock text; Monday, May 1, 2006 5:07 PM.
********************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Wednesday, June 7, 2006 1:29 AM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : VMs: incognito symbols in the Voynich manuscript
Hello all,
I want here to try to bring some attention upon some oddities among the text letters of the Voynich manuscript, and float the idea, that rather than these being scribal errors or corrections, or sloppy handwriting, or ink-flow related, they may instead be intentional cipher-scheme components. For the time being, I name them "incognito symbols". Naturally, I will interweave in the discussion here and there how these oddities might relate with my own ideas and hypotheses on the VMS, but intrinsically these oddities appear to be in there regardless of the merits of my notions, and I think they ought to be considered.
I present 9 examples, all found on the same page. With all of them, casual observation of the Voynich page in its natural size, gives the impression that these incognitos are just common Voynich text letters. However, on close inspection, especially with the magnifyable "ZOOM" .sid image (1), they suggest the possibility that the apparent letter is covering one or more hidden cipher symbols.
What follows, is a take-off from my earlier mention of what I temporarily named the "mirrored-P gallows" symbol in Voynich page f84r (2). Except for some brief comments on f86v at the end, I confine the discussion here to f84r, as it currently is the only page, in this context, that I have carefully combed for these incognitos. In addition to the cases presented, I think there is at least one so-called intruding gallows on this page that merits closer examination from this perspective.
In the following, we will encounter, often, numbers with apparently symbolic significance, that recur throughout the VMS.
f84r shows a 3-part "balneological" illustration, top part, middle, and bottom. In the top part, counting from left, there are 12 bathing sisters. Sister 9 appears to be one of those rare cases of a single-breasted sister. The left hand of this one breast sister appears to be extended behind the tassles dropping down from the curtain, or whatever all that is. If the tassles are water, then the water is abruptly bending into the left hand of sister 11.
Line 1 here means the first body-text line in f84r. It runs directly underneath the green colored "bath" of the upper part of the page's 3-parts illustration. There, above the bathing sisters, are some Voynich words also. These are more commonly called "labels".
I. The 2nd last label. It is the word above the 2nd last bathing sister on the right. The 2nd letter in this Voynich "word" appears like a nice GC-107 (or GC-k), that is, the symmetric double-looped gallows letter. Inspecting this letter under magnification it appears very much to have initially been rendered as a GC-251, and then was "corrected" to appear like a GC-107. Some more discussion on this symbol is in (2). The question is: could it be that decipherment is to take GC-251, instead of the apparent GC-107 ?
II. Line 7, 12th letter from start. Casually, it appears as a GC-251, intruded upon by the descender from a letter above it in line 6. Magnified, it appears more like a tall H, with the right stem's top curved clockwise.
Now, this incognito-H symbol becomes even more curious when we notice that the symbol(s) that intrude upon it from the line above, and the symbol(s) on its own line to its immediate left, are identical: appearing like a triangular 4 with the 4's horizontal stroke connected to a little o on its right. The closest that GC has to this 4o in his transcription alphabet, quite close, is GC-105 or GC-106.
This case makes the very recently introduced idea of a graphic-text branching type transcription system, by vms-list member (and fellow voynich-de@yahoogroups.de member) Modran so attractive: this case II. peculiarity would be noticed at a glance (3). And also, of the transcription schemes that I know of, Modran's new idea, which quite easily combines text and text-graphic-aspects transcription in a powerful compromise, seems to me to be ideally suited for identifying the "non-logically" embedded cipher text sections in the Voynich manuscript that I hypothesized exist in it, and are greatly responsible for causing problems in text decipherment(4). In addition, Modran's proposed system appears to be also well suited for a seamless linking with the stars transcription system that vms-list member Elmar just recently originated, and that permits excellent mathematical deciphering experiments with the VMS star symbols. (5)
III. Line 9, 15th letter from end. Casually it appears as a GC-107, perhaps one where the ink was insufficient for the upper portions of the loops. Magnified, we see two separate symbols, side by side, vaguely suggesting crosses, or equally vaguely, runes.
IV. Line 10, 6th word, 3rd letter. The 7th word is nearly identical, and both words begin with the 4o. On account of the ink, this one is difficult to judge. It may not be an icognito. Magnified, it does appear to have a peculiar connection with a descender from a letter above it in line 9.
V. Line 15, this being the first line in the 2nd paragraph, and running directly underneath the middle part of the 3-part illustration. Counting from left, sister 2 is bent over a bucket of beautiful blue something. Near the right leg of sister 5, is an apparent GC-251. Magnified, it appears to be a tall H, with the top of its right stem curved clockwise - as in II. above.
VI. Line 29 (6th line up from bottom), 3rd letter in the 4th word. Casually it suggests a messy GC-104 (GC-h) that is intruded upon by a GC-101 (GC-e) from the line above. Magnified, we see that the top of the left stem is curved clockwise, and possibly is intended to form a closed loop with the intrusion from above.
VII. Line 30 (5th line up from bottom), 4th last letter. Preceded by a 4o, casually it suggests a GC-107 (GC-k). Magnified, we see that the two vertical stems are not joined, except perhaps for the faintest trace of diffused ink, and also there is no indication that a loop was ever intended atop the right stem, and there is none.
VIII. Line 31 (4th line up from bottom), 1st word, 3rd letter. Casually, it suggests a GC-104 (GC-h). Magnified, we see two very closely spaced, even partly touching, vertical stems, with the right one's top arcing clockwise, but no attempt to close a loop. A possible 4o precedes it.
IX. Line 31 (4th line up from bottom), 2nd word, 2nd letter. The mirrored-P symbol, that motivated launching this vms-list post. Casually it appears as a standard symmetric gallows GC-107 (GC-k), and so GC transcribed it. But magnified, we see that it was definitely intended as a symbol composed of two closely spaced, oppositely-looped-at-the-top stems, the left loop nearly triangular, the right loop elliptical. Takahashi years ago, with the much more limited VMS images available to him, had also transcribed this "letter" as the symmetric gallows, EVA-t. (6)
If intentional incognito symbols are indeed present in the Voynich manuscript, then this mirrored-P in f84r seems a clear example. It certainly fools the eye that is not aware of, or expecting incognito symbols, to take it as just another symmetric gallows letter of the Voynich text.
But, assuming that it is an incognito, what does it mean? It is interesting to note that in the top 3rd of the f84r illustration, we see 8 of the bathing sisters as 4 pairs back-to-back. In the middle 3rd of the illustration we see 4 sisters as 2 pairs back-to-back. And in the bottom 3rd of the illustration none are back-to-back. If this relates directly to the mirrored-P, I do not know.
If the mirrored-P symbol were rendered perfectly, it would suggest, even more than it already does, a kind of face without a mouth, as if meaning to convey "silent witness". Another possibility is that it is a cipher text sections marker, pointing to the left and right blocks of text sections that it separates. Yet another possibility is religious symbolism, perhaps a rejection of Peter with the left-turned, left P, and a favoring of Paul, with the right P. I have discussed the possibility of Petrine - Pauline conflict in the Voynich manuscript in a previous post. (7,8)
There is of course the possibility that this mirrored-P is not one symbol, but two separate side-by-side symbols.
Concerning the H-like symbol in II. and V., there may be an example of it among the hidden symbols in one of Christine de Pizan's pictures that, I noted in another earlier post, has quite a few hidden symbols in it (9). The picture is from British Library Harley MS 4431, and that ms is regarded as one of the best productions of Christine's publishing workshop, heavily representing the so-called "Scribe X", which some Christine scholars identify with Christine herself. In any case, we can be confident that she well controlled this picture, being in a book presented to Queen Isabeau of France. The picture shows Christine in her study, writing. Her study is framed by an arched doorway that has decorations on the top, both on the left and the right. The possible H-like symbol appears in the right side decoration. That it is a symbol, and not just an odd departure from the general lines of the decoration, is reinforced by a more clearly discernible hidden symbol in the left decoration: it resembles a Greek kappa. Kappa Eta might be significant in Christine scholarship, aside from any connection with the Voynich Manuscript.
Finally, I'd like to just mention that the 4o symbol, with its long descender of the 4 portion of it, is visually not all that far off from the "hands" of the so-called "clock" in the f86v nine-rosettes illustration (10). Interestingly, the Crisogonus document mentioned in the referenced discussion, has another kinship of sorts with the VMS: there is no record of where that document was for a span of 431 years. My latest thinking on the f86v clock "hands", and the similar symbol in Crisogonus's document, are that they represent a flexible scribal sign: a way for certain scribes to communicate things among one another. In the Chrysogonus, I think he might be indicating something like EX LIBRIS. In the Voynich I still think the scribe chose to make a point about Petrine versus Pauline Christianity.
Berj / KI3U
(1) Images of the Voynich manuscript (designated by the Beinecke as MS 408) are provided online in several different resolutions by the Beinecke Library of Yale University: http://webtext.library.yale.edu/beinflat/pre1600.ms408.htm
(2) vms-list thread post: Re: VMs: gallows letters in Christine de Pizan's work; Wednesday, May 31, 2006 12:43 AM
(3) vms-list post: VMs: Computable Penstroke Transcription (trying); Friday, June 2, 2006 1:47 AM
(4) See COMMENTS on IV. in vms-list post: VMs: General mcP Hypothesis on the Voynich Manuscript; Sunday, May 21, 2006 11:41 PM
(5) vms-list post: VMs: Transcription of the recipe stars; Tuesday, May 30, 2006 5:09 PM
(6) Takahashi's website provides several very useful VMS study tools, including his entire EVA-alphabet transcription:
http://www.voynich.com/
(7) vms-list post: VMs: Christianity symbolism in the VMS; Monday, May 1, 2006 10:11 AM
(8) vms-list post: VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript; Friday, April 28, 2006 1:14 AM
(9) vms-list post: VMs: Christine de Pizan; Monday, May 22, 2006 12:47 PM
(10) vms-list post: VMs: the clock "hands" in f86v nine-rosettes; Saturday, June 3, 2006 1:01 AM
****************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Wednesday, June 7, 2006 1:16 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : RE: VMs: gallows letters in Christine de Pizan's work
Steve Ekwall wrote Monday, June 5, 2006 1:50 AM:
" *YES* Berj is exactly right below! While i was shown a 'visual folding PAPER' (of how THEY were constructed), the gallows upper loops point to ALL the areas around his imaginary cross area. i deemed to term that a 'TTT or Tic.Tac.Toe shape'. (sorry for any confussions). The gallow you descripe below was THE very 1st one shown, and is the _Starting point_ or Starting GALLOW in the scheme of decoding. It resides at the TOP of your imaginary cross (NOT including the center intersections of a cross bars) It resides in the _middle_ (top) _upper center_ of a TTT area... most hearalded/prominate posistion etc.... addtionally, you mentioned "Tracing_around_imaginary_cross", that *IS EXACTLY HOW THE FOLDING (parchment/vellum) (master) KEY was REVEALED. !! that is, this stroke goes here (up) this stroke goes there (sidewise), this points (or _finishes_ here). the END of this KEY pointer!!!
_simply_ the 'loops' of a gallow show you where on a 'TTT' or your imaginary CROSS-area, any of the 4 quadrants are indiited into play at this/that time. [see also : the c_gallow(s)_c (its mirror )]
THIS produces your so-called "SELF-MODIFYING-CODE"
up-rightS (1st), right/left( 2nd), top down (3rd), bottom up (4th) !!!!!!!!!!!! :-)
Then *see* its MIRROR !! :-)
###
#*0
000
simple lower case characters as in "eva e" / which is the same as #1 Gallows(eva t)/ pointed by their shape(s)... or/ a "9" pointer (points) to lower left TTT (your _cross_ quadrant), a "4" points to upper left etc..
finally, ES said this is fro ALL, for 'EVERYONE!', "but, especially for WOMAN !"
best to all :-) -=se=- "
Steve
I am mulling over your above comments, with a feeling there is something I'm not yet seeing, especially in light of the data I just posted. (1) I wish Modran would produce a transcript of f84r with his newly proposed transcription system. I just have a strong feeling that with Modran's transcript we might see something jump right out of that page. (2,1)
Berj
(1) vms-list post: VMs: incognito symbols in the Voynich manuscript; Wednesday, June 7, 2006 1:29 AM
(2) vms-list post: VMs: Computable Penstroke Transcription (trying); Friday, June 2, 2006 1:47 AM
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From : Nick Pelling <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Friday, June 9, 2006 9:55 AM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: RE: "The Curse of the Voynich"
Hi Berj,
At 09:10 09/06/2006 -0400, Berj N. Ensanian wrote: Are autographed copies available from you directly?
Yes, I'll be selling direct as well as through Amazon etc, and will be happy to sign copies sent that way. Having said that, I'll post more about this closer to the time. Cheers, .....Nick Pelling.....
*******************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Saturday, June 10, 2006 1:17 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Student Project; Meaning in Repetitiveness
Hi David, Regarding [1],
I know a little bit about television, both analog and digital, because in days past I engineered and built both slow and fast-scan television systems, and it is another reason why I like your idea a lot. (If I recall, vms-list member Philip Neal has on his Voynich website some similar ideas inline with this discussion.)
From my television experiences, I remember that one can define a fairly simple equation involving the image rendering variables, like linear or non-linear line tracing, interlaced or partly interlaced versus sequential lines, pixel to screen ratio, scan phase sync jitter, and so forth, all for the purpose of obtaining a formula that will quickly give an idea / estimate of how much distortion to expect in the received image, as a result of deviations from the intended transmission variables. As it turns out, and could be expected, the observer's ability, under distortion conditions, to correctly make out the basics of the transmitted image, say a right triangle, depends a lot on the factors just mentioned (and others not relevant here if the Voynich text ink is accurately reflecting what was written centuries ago), with some video shemes being well tolerant of distortion, and others extremely sensitive to distortion. Of course there is also observer skill / subjectivity involved.
Now here is what really stands out from my experiences that I think relates directly to what I am driving at with my question to you regarding the incognito-H in f84r that seems to be involved in line linking. In the laboratory, during experiments (television systems in this case), you get a lot of unexpected and unintended sudden results, some of them arising from simple mistakes (flipped the wrong switch, set a pulse generator incorrectly etc.) and sometimes these events produce astonishing results on the screen that give you ideas you likely never would have thought of otherwise, even though you could have without ever having gone near a laboratory, but just done a lot of doodling with pen and pencil.
What I'm thinking here is partial / momentary scan-trace jumping, especially backwards into the already rendered part of the image raster or vector-image. Remarkable image effects can be obtained depending on the situation, and on the particular screen phosphor-persistence, effects that would startle even the Hollywood image makers, and of course the experimenter thinks: could I control this, and use it for something interesting?
Many of these effects are ponderable in an illustrated page like f84r that is to be perceived by a human mind that is well capable of visual imagery, and would have no problem with seeing in their mind effects that are explicit for everyone on a cathode-ray tube screen with a certain phosphor persistence.
The incognito-H with its associated 4o symbols across lines, in f84r, and especially because of the suggestive geometry of the H itself, gives me the strong feeling that something like controlled trace jumping is going on in f84r. That is, even if the text symbols are intrinsically not very deeply encoded, there is though a sort of zig-zag'ing around the page going on. If yes, then transcription systems and analytics based upon them must deal with it.
Berj
[1] this vms-list thread, Saturday, June 10, 2006 11:54 AM
"Hi Berj
Before I try to find your specific references, let me just mention perhaps in connection with your question ..............What are we then looking at? Maybe I can put it in a somewhat fanciful way: Each page of the Vms is, in part and in a sense, a quite ancient television picture; that is to say a scanned image of a place , or if you will, a map of that place. Actually, it remains to be seen if it is "digital" in the sense that each character grouping represents some quantitative description of a picture- an ancient "pixel", or, on the other hand "analogue" in that the character groupings are themselves pictorial. We'll see... David "
*************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Saturday, June 10, 2006 4:16 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Student Project; Meaning in Repetitiveness
Hi David,
Regarding [1], yes, but the effects can be far, far beyond striped shirt. These effects are difficult to describe in list-post plain-text; but a couple of hours in a good physics laboratory would have you leave believing you had experienced an epiphany; if you ever get the chance to visit a lab where real-time cosmic ray research is being done in conjunction with video recording of same, grab it by all means.
With laboratory cathode-ray tube optics, the perceived momentary effects can be three-dimensional when viewed from certain angles and distances, and linked with others, while from other angles and distances they are not seen at all. This is just one of the reasons why oldtimers prefer to keep a good old 60's era Tektronix analog dual-beam oscilloscope around, no matter the latest greatest digital stuff.
Most importantly perhaps, one gets the strong impression that the mind's persistence of visual imagery is the key to seeing these phantom images in the first place.
(Similar audio effects I am omitting here, because as of yet we have not got much suggestion that sounds or music are also being transmitted in the Voynich, although let us not discount the possibility!)
But let me try here to briefly describe concretely what I'm getting at for a relatively simple possibility with the Voynich manuscript, and a symbol like the incognito-H. [2]
The observer of Voynich page f84r encounters the incognito-H symbol group, and within the observer's mind is triggered, instantly, a shift in attention to some other position on the page where, combined with visual recall of previously observed Voynich symbology, text and / or graphic, the then and there observed page element combines in the observer's mind with the trigger symbols to form the image of the intended symbol, and it is seen in the observer's mind.
Thus, the intended cipher symbol, even if it is just a text letter that is formed by juxtaposition of separate page elements from the trigger and its target, is under normal circumstances totally invisible: it was never even scripted onto the page!
I mean, how clever is that?!
And perhaps this is what prophet Ekwall's Trithemian inspirational source has been trying to get across to us all along with "NOW DO YOU SEE IT?!!!".
This stuff can be handled mathematically I believe, with simple techniques involving integer sequences anyone can deal with, to the more advanced machinery like elliptic / theta functions that require thorough math foundation, but in any case, we must first recognize that a very intelligent and educated late medieval thinker could easily have conceived such a scheme, and make our transcriptions, or at least our conceptions of the Voynich manuscript, be flexible enough NOT to filter it out a priori. I believe the Voynich manuscript was intended to be read, by some people, and there is order of some kind in it.
And, I keep coming back to the thought, that this kind of intricately clever cipher scheme, suggests to me a woman mastermind behind it all, weaving and knitting a mindboggling pattern, that to her was second nature. [3,4]
Berj / KI3U
[1] this vms-list thread, Saturday, June 10, 2006 2:06 PM
"Hi Berj
I haven't seen that site but I would be astonished if others have not noticed these effects.
If I understand your point , something like the famous "striped shirt "effect which can interfere with video might be going on....
But regardless- if anything, I am ............David"
[2] vms-list post: VMs: incognito symbols in the Voynich manuscript; Wednesday, June 7, 2006 1:29 AM
[3] vms-list post: VMs: General mcP Hypothesis on the Voynich Manuscript; Sunday, May 21, 2006 11:41 PM
[4] vms-list post: VMs: Christine de Pizan; Monday, May 22, 2006 12:47 PM
******************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Sunday, June 11, 2006 1:03 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: My Conjecture
Hello Nick
You wrote Sunday, June 11, 2006 5:04 AM: "... but no so much about the end of the world, as the end of history."
This is similar to my reaction to Perigee: Zero. To me the most intriguing aspect of the idea in the hypothesis that Michael and his sister are constructing, is a collaboration of networked intellectuals discussing cyclical endings of a way of life, that, I think, need not necessarily mean the end of the physical world. If nothing else, it gives another pespective to keep in mind when looking for historical links to the Voynich mansucript.
Berj
************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Monday, June 12, 2006 4:30 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : RE: VMs: Comments splitting lines in EVA
Hello Smari
I think you are discovering that one has to make some decisions on their own with any particular transcript.
I've come across some of your math on the web, and although I can't read Icelandic, I can see from the equations you are serious, and well equipped to do the Markov etc. that you have in mind.
I never give advice, but do express opinions, and in my opinion, it is a good idea before using someone else's Voynich transcript, to handcopy some Voynich text - that quickly gives you some idea of what compormises were made by the transcriber.
Berj
Smári McCarthy wrote Mon, 12 Jun 2006 19:12:48 +0000:
"Hello, Is there anybody specific who's responsible for maintaining the EVA? I'm wondering because................... structure. Comments would be appreciated. Thanks in advance, Smári. -- Smári P. McCarthy
smari@ (+354)-662-2701"
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From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Monday, June 12, 2006 10:09 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Comments splitting lines in EVA; more questions from an amateur
Hello David
You wrote Monday, June 12, 2006 8:09 PM:
" My point is that, irregardless of whether the textual matter in VMs contains linguistic information, its overarching compositional structure is formed around a visual model of sufficient complexity to be considered "unique". "
Now that is one of the best single sentences I've seen written in this forum lately. Because, a Voynich newcomer, who first learned about the VMS this morning, and only this afternoon joined this forum, still would, from that sentence, get a good overall idea of what many veteran Voynich students think about the manuscript, and without being mystified by the VMS-and-this-forum specific lingo.
You are one of the few in this forum who has actually seen the Voynich manuscript.
Berj
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From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, June 13, 2006 12:10 AM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: incognito symbols in the Voynich manuscript
Hello Keith
You wrote Monday, June 12, 2006 4:56 PM:
" I just looked at 84r again, and it is perfectly clear that the right-hand third or so of the first section of text was written after the left side. Not as a second column, but to make the output look better. Look at the difference in the ink density. Compare this with 81r, and imagine filling in the right hand side of 81r.
This tends to show that the garbage theory is more likely than cypher or something incredibly clever. I am still trying to get to the phonetics, though.
As secret writing, I believe that if I had a page representing a genuine romance language or dialect, it would not take much effort to read it. It certainly would not be very secure. "
Yes I think you are right - those parts of the first paragraph seem to have been written somewhat separately, though I'm not sure in what order.
Now also, the 4o-incognito-H symbols group, where I include in it everything from "9" to "9" across lines 6 and 7, is almost identically repeated across lines 7 and 8, and in this instance the ink looks a bit like the darker ink of the right third or so text block that you point out.
Actually, with minor variations, that line-linking symbol group is seen in a few other places throughout the first paragraph of f84r. I just can't believe that all that can be ignored, and still a "text" analysis, of whatever mathematical sophistication, can be embarked upon with high confidence that the real thing is being analyzed.
Moreover, the 4o symbol participates in other cross-line linkings, for example with the descender of the 4 contacting the double-c symbol, and not just in the first paragraph. (1)
But I don't think this supports the-text-is-garbage theory. I think it supports that the "text" symbols are objects, which first have a mathematical character, geometric coordinates perhaps at the very least.
As to phonetics, where we are pondering that the "text" was dictated to the scribe, I think there is a fairly simple way that could have been accomplished, if indeed that was the scheme. We note that many of the most common text "letters" in the Voynich manuscript strongly resemble Hindu-Arabic numerals as they were written around the time we think the Voynich manuscript was scripted. So, a dictation could go something like this:
40409 2 09 94044712 40440669 4000689 ....... etc.
where the dictation of the numbers was spoken in their language, whatever language, any language in which the Hindu-Arabic numerals were speakable, that both dictator and scribe knew:
forty-thousand-four-hundred-nine two zero-nine ....etc.
Berj
(1) Lately I've been thinking of the utility of a good way, within posts like this one that are largely conversational, to refer to Voynich text symbols without always having to cite their identification in one or another transcription system.
For example, if we say that on Voynich page f84r, in the 1st line of the 1st paragraph, the 3rd word begins with a 4o symbol, then even newcomers, who may not yet have familiarity with various transcription tables, much less have them handy, can nevertheless quickly locate what is being pointed to just by glancing at the image of f84r. The 4o symbols looks like a 4o. Or more precisely looks like 4-o .The double-c symbol looks like two side-by-side ordinary c's, joined by a horizontal bar at their top.
And so forth. I'll see how it goes: if confusion results, then I guess I'll just have to cite GC-1 (GC-49) etc. everytime instead of "double-c". We do have to live with a multitude of transcription schemes anyway.
***********************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, June 13, 2006 11:07 AM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Comments splitting lines in EVA; more questions from an amateur
Yes of course David. I just appreciated your compactness and newcomer-friendly phrasing in that sentence.
I often ponder how newcomers react to these forum discussions. What concerns me most there is, that I believe the human mind often operates so that initial impressions of a mystery can produce flashes of great insight. And then, as this new observer becomes more involved, and comes more under the influence of orthodox thinking on the mystery, the initial and perhaps very valuable insights might be self-suppressed, for a while anyway.
The first thing ever Voynich that I laid eyes on back in 1999 was Gabriel Landini's 1997 rendition / interpretation of the first paragraph of the first page (f1r) of the Voynich manuscript. I was instantly recruited into the pursuit of the Voynich mystery by that masterful piece of artwork. My notes from then indicate that I had some initial impressions / inspirations about the VMS, some of which I began to suppress as I studied the Voynich story, and it has only been lately that I have been returning to some of those initial impressions, and making some good use of them.
Berj
From: [ david's e-adr ] Reply-To: vms-list@voynich.net To: vms-list@voynich.net
Subject: Re: VMs: Comments splitting lines in EVA; more questions from an amateur
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 08:11:32 EDT
In a message dated 6/12/06 7:12:50 PM, ki3u writes: " .................. "
Thank you for saying that about my sentence. But I feel what I was trying to suggest in that sentence is still only
partially said by the sentence. It needs more work. For instance, I need to do some self-education on pattern
recognition methods, which I am pretty sure will address the ideas I am presenting in a quantitative form.
And, at the end of that process, pattern-recognition must connect somehow with the linguistic questions. david
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From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, June 13, 2006 4:14 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: In defence of reason...
Erni(the optimist) wrote Tuesday, June 13, 2006 1:43 PM: " I see the specter of Hoax has once again risen in the minds of Voynichologists. . . {evil laughter - Boowah-hah-hah :-) } Is that not the ultimate triumph of t............... "
Chuckle! Well I've been enjoying the debate anyway, observing Marke and Nick advance the respective positions. Personally, I am extremely, extremely skeptical that the Voynich manuscript is a hoax, but I have to keep that possibility open, even though I don't like it much: the VMS could be that clever and void-of-interesting-doctrine, and the intent was to ever keep the hoax spectre alive.
So I think, Marke is right to imply that the hoax possibility is as complex as any of the other possibilities, and our analytic thinking could suffer if we just dismiss it. It is after all a general idea, hoax is, much more difficult for me to dismiss than a specific idea, say sulphur baths in this or that Voynich illustration.
On Nick's side, I'm glad he's lifting the veil a little bit on some realities about Voynich-is-a-hoax, or worse, Voynich-is-hedge-maybe-a-hoax. These realities can take a newcomer Voynich student a very long time to thoroughly understand, things like organized propaganda aimed at mass markets, and the pushing of the impression that the Voynich mystery has finally been solved, when it hasn't.
But perhaps in the future we will see a movie, "The Curse of the Voynich", wherein we will enjoy the thrilling adventures of Professor Pelinik, the dashing brilliant young paleographer, who discovers a 15th century letter among some dusty library files of Provencal miscellany, deciphering it to be not simple poetry, but a mathematical puzzle said to be a curse on certain would-be readers of it, written by one Roger Rudolph, to a mysterious lady "IC", and making reference to a grand literary collaboration with grand implications for the future of the world.
Berj
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From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, June 13, 2006 7:18 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: In defence of reason...
Pel Nickling, er Prof. Pelinik, er, Nick Pelling wrote Tuesday, June 13, 2006 5:49 PM:
" The secret history of what really happened is much more vivid and complex than anything a roomful of Hollywood screenwriters could have imagined... though I'm getting ahead of myself here, when I should instead be polishing that tricky bit in Chapter 4. :-) It's true I've already done a treatment for a Curse screenplay (I came to writing through short stories and screenwriting): however, you may be saddened to hear that the semantics checker in my word processor auto-deleted the smouldering historian hero Pel Nickling, particularly when my wife wanted him played by Tom Cruise. But with longer legs. :-) "
:-) Hi Nick
I have to admit that when I first heard your title "The Curse of the Voynich" it immediately brought into my mind a future screenplay, and triggered my imagination to produce all sorts of plots. I was sure you were ahead of us on that.
Actually this all brings out something that has been rather routine for me all along, and I would think for at least a few other Voynich students: I'm in the habit of imagining adventurous scenarios around the Voynich mystery, from its days of origin right up to the present, and of course sometimes I inject myself into the adventures as a hero :-). These fanatasies serve a very useful purpose in exploring ideas about the mystery, like a Gedanken Experiment taken with allegorical poetic license. More than once, these imaginary Voynich scenarios have produced good pointers for me to follow up on: I was through one of these Gedanken Experiments led directly to taking a close look at the Voynich page f85v cosmological illustration, specifically the middle panel of that 3-page foldout, and discover the embedded figures in it (1).
Speaking of longer gallows, er I mean legs, coincidentally it was just in chapter 4-o that I had imagined that Prof. Pelinik, after a harrowing trek up into the Transylvania mountains to find the cave of the legendary hermit prophet Ekwastev, and receive from him the lost, but still cryptic, key to the puzzle: "SEEGALFOLD", that Pelinik is once again ambushed by the incomparably beautiful temptress, evil Eva, ever attempting to seduce him away from his quest.
:-)
Berj
(1) vms-list-post: VMs: The very Heart of the Voynich Manuscript; Friday, April 28, 2006 1:14 AM. see IVb.
******************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Wednesday, June 14, 2006 9:17 AM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: RE: In defence of reason...
David wrote Wednesday, June 14, 2006 8:39 AM:
" ........ Again, a carefully thought -out plan for dissimulation, perhaps. "
What about a distinction between conscious, semi-conscious, and unconscious / subconscious motives?
How easy is it to attempt to consciously create a hoax, that does not somewhere in it bear subconsciously precipitated traces of the hoaxer?
Berj
**************************************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, June 13, 2006 10:30 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : RE: VMs: incognito symbols in the Voynich manuscript
Pascal Bourguignon wrote Tuesday, June 13, 2006 9:28 PM:
" Yes. My father could cut a sheet of paper straight with scisors and without any rule. He never told me how to do it. He could draw perfect circles on a blackboard too...
There are abilities that are lost on use, computer generation. I don't know if I could still write with a pen! "
I agree. Back in the early 70's I had my own publishing operation - everything was cut and paste and glue and lay out with rulers and compasses etc., no computers of course. After a while I'd take chances on the layout by skipping on measuring everything. I discovered I had developed an eidetic image of a grid in my mind that I could superimpose upon the work paper, and achieve excellent alignments. It was a matter of continuous practice, plus no particular prejudice against the possibility of it being do-able without rulers etc. Not to mention the better eyesight of youth.
Berj
******************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Wednesday, June 14, 2006 9:17 AM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: RE: In defence of reason...
David wrote Wednesday, June 14, 2006 8:39 AM:
" ........ Again, a carefully thought -out plan for dissimulation, perhaps. "
What about a distinction between conscious, semi-conscious, and unconscious / subconscious motives?
How easy is it to attempt to consciously create a hoax, that does not somewhere in it bear subconsciously precipitated traces of the hoaxer?
Berj
***************************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Thursday, June 15, 2006 12:57 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : RE: VMs: Why not these two?
tmazanec1 wrote Thursday, June 15, 2006 11:57 AM:
" Why are these books not as notorious as the Voynich Manuscript?
Codex Seraphinianus
Rohonczi Codex "
They are notorious to some degree. If you look at all three you may well conclude that the Voynich manuscript is derived from something more interesting.
My opinion on the Codex Seraphinianus:
Around 1980 the Italian architect Luigi Serafini published his "Codex Seraphinianus", an expensive work of art in the form of a book, that is said by some to have been partly inspired by perceptions of the Voynich Manuscript. Allegedly, the book is an encyclopedia of an imaginary alien world. It contains surrealistic illustrations, and text written in an invented language and script said to be "meaningless".
Apparently the book has its own student community. The images I have seen of this book and its pages, on the internet, give me a completely different subjective reaction from the Voynich Manuscript, aside from some obvious Voynich elements borrowings. The VMS, at first sight, immediately gave me the impression that its material originated from a very serious long-term tradition somewhere back in antiquity, and that the elements that went into it were the conceptual product of many thinkers. In contrast, the Seraphinianus strikes me as what I have read it is: the work of one artist.
The VMS radiates serious intelligence, whereas the Seraphinianus projects sensationalism, by an undeniably intelligent author. The VMS gives me the feeling that it is a bible of sorts, but the Seraphinianus strikes me as chiefly of great interest to psychologists studying the world of modern, disturbing / disturbed art.
My opinion on the Rohonczi Codex (1):
The Voynich manuscript is not the only mysterious old book that has defied understanding - there is for example the so-called Rohonczi Codex. Like the VMS, it too is illustrated, and about as old. And, again like the VMS, unsuccessful attempts to decode its text have caused some to say that the book is meaningless.
But the VMS has the status that it has, because of its history, its high strangeness, its apparently multiple themes, and perhaps above all, the great beauty of its script. Except perhaps for one or two of its many, the illustrations in the Rohonczi are not strange, and its script appears crude compared with the VMS script.
Overall, the Rohonczi illustrations suggest they are a simple connected series, and tell a story, perhaps the history of a tribe or a priviliged family, with Christianity as a major theme. In contrast, the Voynich illustrations suggest a complicated interweaving of several themes, involving several disciplines.
But, the Rohonczi script, assuming it is meaningful, may turn out to be even more difficult to decode than the VMS script because it has so many different symbols, suggesting that the writing system may not be ordinary alphabetic even for portions of its "text".
Berj / KI3U
(1) For online information and images of the Rohonczi Codex see: http://www.dacia.org/codex/
************************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Friday, June 16, 2006 9:59 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : VMs: Christine de Pizan and the Voynich Manuscript
Hello to all,
In the ongoing effort to explore the possibility of a connection between Europe's first lady of letters, Christine de Pizan (c. 1365 - 1430 ?), and the sources that eventually precipitated the Voynich manuscript, VMS, I wish here to point out for comparison two separate manuscript illustrations. (1,2)
For newcomers to Voynich study, the background is, very briefly, as follows:
The General mcP Hypothesis on the Voynich manuscript, posits that a 15th century secret collaborative effort of intellectuals, including at least one mathematician, was inspired and guided by a woman master mind, she designated in the hypothesis as MmsP, and that these collaborators created an anti-misogynism and counter-Roman Church doctrine for a secret sisterhood. This doctrine, highly encrypted, especially so symbolically, was collected into a master document, manuscript P, mcP, that remains lost; the mcP may not necessarily have been completed before the death of MmsP. And that the Voynich manuscript is a surviving fragment of a copy of the mcP, copied by someone unknown. And that the immediately indicated likely candidate for MmsP is Christine de Pizan, or one of her early followers. (3,4,5)
The development of the above hypothesis is still in its very early stages.
Here, the two illustrations I would like to present for comparison are on:
f.183 of Harley MS 4431 of the British Library. This is a page in the so-called "Queen's Manuscript", generally regarded as one of the finest examples of Christine's publishing workshop. In the f.183 illustration, "Nine Muses bathing in the fountain of wisdom", the Sybil is seen showing to Christine the bathing scene. (6)
f78v of the Voynich Manuscript, a page in the so-called "balneological section" of the VMS, has an illustration of a group of 9 bathing VMS sisters. (7)
In this writing I will confine the pointers to some graphical elements; newcomers may know that the search for historical graphical elements in common with the VMS, is routine in Voynich research.
We will here be concerned with symbolic content common to 2 small paintings.
Christine's f.183 is in a c.1411 presentation book presented to the Queen of France.
VMS f78v is in the codex that since the 1930's has borne the reputation of "the world's most mysterious manuscript"; in the VMS study community there is quite a bit of support for a 15th century origin of the VMS. Physically, the VMS gives the impression of being a hurried copying job done with limited resources.
Viewing the 2 illustrations:
Compare the bathing tubs. Note especially that both have fluid flow to, or from the tub, and the flow contacts the arm of the nearest bather.
Note that in both illustrations the fluid in the tubs is definitely not depicted as clear blue water.
Note that in both illustrations the "windows" in the tub walls have symbols hidden in them. (8)
Compare the curvature of the f78v tub with the curvature of the f.183 ground that contacts the tub.
Compare the 9 bathers. There may be alternative views on this, but at least one discernable grouping common to both bathing scenes is 3, 3, 1, and 2 bathers.
Note that in both illustrations one sister has her hand upon the belly of another sister. [That most of the hundreds of sisters in the VMS illustrations, on account of their "plump" appearance, suggest women with child, has often been pondered in Voynich study.] In f.183 the touching sister's wimple head dress is prominently double-peaked (or "horned" as some writers have it), while the touched sister's wimple is relatively flat. Correspondingly, from the symbolism perspective, in f78v the touching sister has long hair, while the touched sister has short hair.
Note that in f.183 one of the left-most muses in the rear group of 3 has her navel rendered uniquely - it appears almost like the outline of a shield or emblem. Correspondingly, note that in f78v in the left-most group of 3, the right-most sister's navel is by far the strongest rendered of all 9 bathing sister's navels.
Note that in f.183 the flow fluid is closely situated to the launch point of Pegasus, whereas in f78v the flow fluid is closely situated to the launch point of the text - the first, and flourished, "gallows" symbol at top left, that features 3 groups of 3 lines, and a dot within its loop.
I would like to conclude by making this personal observation: in 7 years of Voynich manuscript study, I have found no other single historical source that comes even close in richness to providing good ponder-able connections to the Voynich manuscript, as does Christine de Pizan. At every turn I see that her works have everything, including the most important element of all - the prime numbers, and the use of prime numbers relationships in complicated, hidden messages, and displays of advanced knowledge. (13)
It is, I sincerely believe, to the benefit of both the Voynich and Christine scholarship communities, to actively begin taking a look at each other's material, because both communities have deep mysteries confronting them, and the solutions, along with stunning new surprises, may well be finally ready to be discovered. (14)
Berj / KI3U
(1) Note that, unfortunately, Christine's name is given variously in the literature, for example Christine de Pisa, or Christine de Pisan.
(2) The main online forum concerned with the Voynich manuscript is the vms-list founded by James Gillogly:
http://www.voynich.net/
Gillogly's Voynich work has a direct connection back to the one indispensable reference work in the field, written c.1976 by the classical philologist Mary D'Imperio:
The Voynich Manuscript - An Elegant Enigma, by M.E. D'Imperio, Aegean Park Press, ISBN 0-89412-038-7
The searchable archives of the vms-list, managed by Nick Pelling, is here:
http://voynich.ms/
(3) vms-list post: VMs: General mcP Hypothesis on the Voynich Manuscript; May 21, 2006 11:41 PM
(4) vms-list post: VMs: Christine de Pizan; May 22, 2006 12:47 PM
(5) vms-list post: VMs: gallows letters in Christine de Pizan's work; May 27, 2006 3:01 PM
(6) http://ibs001.colo.firstnet.net.uk/britishlibrary/controller/textsearch?text=Christine&start=6&startid=5763&width=4&height=2&idx=1
(7) The Voynich Manuscript is MS 408 in the Beinecke Library of Yale University:
http://webtext.library.yale.edu/beinflat/pre1600.ms408.htm
(8) For discussions of hidden symbols in the VMS, as well as in Christine's works, see (4,5), and (9,10,11,12)
(9) vms-list post: VMs: incognito symbols in the Voynich manuscript; June 7, 2006 1:29 AM
(10) vms-list post: Re: VMs: Student Project; Meaning in Repetitiveness; June 10, 2006 1:17 PM
(11) vms-list post: Re: VMs: Student Project; Meaning in Repetitiveness; June 10, 2006 4:16 PM
(12) vms-list post: Re: VMs: incognito symbols in the Voynich manuscript; June 13, 2006 12:10 AM
(13) For discussion of prime numbers and prime numbers theorems in the VMS, see for example,
vms-list post: VMs: f58r prime numbers & zodiac 100; April 12, 2006 2:10 AM
vms-list post: VMs: Voynich f67v prime numbers, de Molay & Knights Templar; April 22, 2006 1:29 AM
vms-list post: VMs: braided prime number equations in f6r; April 4, 2006 1:39 AM
In the future I will post more specific material about the prime numbers in Christine de Pizan's works, that I am currently discovering. For example, Christine's poem, Song of Joan of Arc, is loaded with prime numbers, and prime numbers relationships, that cross-link verse lines and concepts in the poem, in remarkable, hidden, ways. It is already inconceivable to me, just from the Joan of Arc poem, that Christine did not understand the allegory that the prime numbers are to non-primes, what the gods are to mere mortals. But we have her own testimony on her appreciation of mathematics, especially when she talks about her father in her works.
(14) There are several major mysteries surrounding the life of Christine de Pizan. And, when we note Christine's own admissions of concern with hidden or parallel communications in writing, several more mysteries could easily be pondered. Then there is a historical mystery concerning the "The Lost Tapestries of the City of Ladies" :
http://www.ucpress.edu/books/pages/9767/9767.ch01.html
Appealing once more to the late Voynich student, Yale Prof. Robert S. Brumbaugh, when he felt it would be necessary for a certain amount of "mad imagination" to make progress in solving the Voynich mystery, I suggest that it might also be very interesting to consider the lost tapestries of the City of Ladies in connection with the grand visual climax of the Voynich Manuscript, f86v, the "nine-rosettes" or "nine-medallions" foldout that is comprised of 6 of the VMS's pages: perhaps what is depicted on f86v is what was depicted on those lost tapestries.
*************************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : voynich-de@yahoogroups.de
Sent : Saturday, June 17, 2006 2:38 PM
To : voynich-de@yahoogroups.de
Subject : [voynich-de] Voynich Manuskript Traumforschung: Symbol Faltungen
Hallo an alle
Ich hatte vorgestern Nacht einen merkwuerdigen Traum ueber das VM.
Sofort danach aufwachen, kam es mir im Sinn das die Bedeutungen in diesem Traum starke Aehnlichkeiten besitzen mit Ideen die schon vielmal Steve Ekwall auf der vms-list ausgesprochen hat.
Also dann, hier ist der Traum:
Ich sehe vor mir ein Fenster dessen Glass die Farbe von Pergament hat.
Auf dem oberen waagerechten Rahmenstueck des Fensters, sitzt ein symmetrisches Voynich Zeichen (GC-107, auch genannt GC-k).
Jetzt falted sich die linke, drei-eckige, Schlaufe in das Zeichen ein, und das Zeichen ist jetzt zu einen un-symmetrisches GC-104 (auch genannt GC-h) umgewandelt worden.
Es geht weiter. Das GC-h falted sich zusammen und umwandelt sich zu einem Zeichen das genau so aussieht wie ein auf dem Kopf gestellt V .
Nun dreht sich das V nach Uhrzeigersinn, und verschwindet in den Fenster-rahmen.
Berj
********************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Saturday, June 17, 2006 5:05 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : RE: VMs: Christine de Pizan and the Voynich Manuscript
Steve Ekwall wrote June 17, 2006 2:04 AM:
" Remember also VMS f78v (dual out waters of this tub) seems to ~match-up~ with VMS f81r (dual inputs waters of that 'lower tub').. (place this pages side by side etc.. and note the starting gallows on each of these pages too ! ES said the pages were NOT in order, but water flows (usually down hill) :-) "
and:
" p.s. ES said especally NOTE the Arms & Leg positionings of the bathing women. (actually recalling back.... ES=> "_Note the Arms and KNEES of each woman_"). , while not applicable in these 2 pages, they are seen well in the bathology section. "
Hello Steve
I think you are right about the arm and other body-part positions etc. of the sisters - these seem to be some kind of signalling system, a sisters body language, that is far more complicated, and subtle, than what I had picked up on previously.
I just had a look at f78v and f81r together, combined in a single image, directly side-by-side, f78v+f81r, as per your suggestion - I'm glad you motivated me to do this.
I noticed not just the match-up, but a couple of things new to me.
There are 3 flow-connected tubs. It was standard for Christine to write her works in 3 parts. From the sister counts, and flows, I'm wondering if one of the messages is:
that 2 aspects of a work, or part of a work, associated with 9, and 1 aspect of another work associated with 7, heavily influenced a derivative work associated with, or characterized by 6.
The starting gallows letter on f81r is ligatured to the tub above it, with the ligature depicting what is apparently a foot for the tub - that foot resembles, a lot, some of the frame corners, especially the bottom-right ones, in early illustrations in Christine's books.
There is something else odd about that tub - take a look at its right-lower end, where the "word" o-ribbon-9 ends the 1st text-line. Doesn't it look like a temporary sheet had lain atop f81r when the tub was being drawn, and it left some traces? I'm wondering if templates were used to lay out the pages for symbolically accurate copies.
At top right, the right-most sister appears to have her left hand outside the tub.
In the bottom tub of f81r, the left-most sister by the flow-port does not have her arm-hand directly, or emphatically anyway, involved with the flow.
Berj
******************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Sunday, June 18, 2006 9:13 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Christine de Pizan and the Voynich Manuscript
Keith wrote Sunday, June 18, 2006 5:04 PM:
" Did you see the male builder on the roof of the city of ladies, with a pulley, putting up roof trusses? "
Hello Keith
Yes I'm aware of the guy worker in that Christine illustration copy (1). In that particular illustration copy one of the "women" that Dame Justice is leading into the city, looks rather masculine also. But it's not at all suprising when you start reading Christine. She makes an emphatic point that in some circumstances a woman has to become like a man. I think the guys in this illustration are an allegorical showing of her point.
The Christine scholars study the differences between exemplars of the same illustration in different copies, copies all prepared under Christine's supervision. I've seen two different examples of Dame Justice leading the women into the City. The women counts differ.
From reading Christine, I think it might be that she meant for ALL her COPIES to be examined, and for details differences between them to be observed as clues to a "grand work". I believe it's possible that Christine envisioned her works - remember she didn't just write them, but also fabricated and manufactured them - to tell her complete message only when her copies are regarded as a complete set. She writes with emphasis about the numbers of her copies. So I wonder if Christine planned her singularly regarded works and copies to transmit multiple actual works, beginning this mechanism early on in her career by recycling previous writings, and then finding it easier and easier to increase the depth and complexity of her transmissions. My impression here is based on observing the mathematics across her works - she is forever linking things with numbers relationships, from what I see.
I am still hampered by Christine-novice factors; for one thing it's only been 3 months since I've noticed her, and only one month since actively researching her - I have not yet gotten good at digging up information on her. For example, I still have not been able to find out the actual dimensions of BL Harley MS 4431, so I can get an accurate idea of the sizes of those miniatures (2). Maybe I've seen the specification but overlooked it. Another problem is my French - I got a D in that subject in high school, and the last time I used the language to any degree was in Paris in 1969. So, we labor under some deficiencies.
Actually I was wondering if you had taken a look at the Voynich f81r page, and had any comments on why the parchment looks odd near the right end of the upper tub. I had thought maybe a separate sheet had lain on that page when it was being rendered, perhaps like a template. I know you have a good eye for a lot of these things.
Now, getting back directly to possible Christine-Voynich connections:
I was last night reading Christine's Le Chemin de Long Estude (The Book of the Long Road to Learning, 1402-1403). And I was reminded of vms-list member Ken's recent observations / ideas on Voynich f86v (3), that thankfully agreed on one important point with an earlier observation of mine (that the central rosette in f86v represents Jerusalem).
In the long road to learning, the Cumean Sybil takes Christine on a journey (this is in a dream Christine has), and one of the things the sybil shows Christine is the other 9 muses bathing, i.e. the subject of the illustration that this thread was launched for.
In her dream, Christine is taken by the sybil on a world tour, a map of which would seem remarkably reminiscent of Ken's map conceptions of the Voynich nine-rosettes illustration, f86v.
Berj
(1) The BL Harley MS 4431 version of this illustration, "Justice enters the City of Ladies", is here:
http://ibs001.colo.firstnet.net.uk/britishlibrary/controller/textsearch?text=Christine&start=25&startid=1986&width=4&height=2&idx=2
(2) Take a close look at the miniatures in MS 4431 - the artistic control is almost unbelievable in some of them. For example, take a look at King Charles VI's (the insane king) face in:
http://ibs001.colo.firstnet.net.uk/britishlibrary/controller/textsearch?text=Christine&start=25&&idx=1&startid=13101
and look at the magnified version by clicking on it. How did Christine's illustrator achieve such an effect in a miniature? I was trying to visualize myself doing it - using magnifying glasses!
(3) vms-list post: Re: VMs: Plausible explanation of the Rosettes page; Tuesday, May 30, 2006 1:57 AM
wherein Ken writes:
" My theory is that the Rosette appears to be more akin to a mappa mundi. You mentioned the sun images at the top left and bottom right. If you align those suns east (bottom right) and west (top left), The architectural styles of the individual circles appear to match styles of the appropriate lands. To demonstrate, let's number the nine circles in 1-9, top left to bottom right in three rows. Turn the folio counter clockwise 45 degrees so circle #3 is at the top. This means circle #1 is west, #3 is north, #7 is south and #9 is east. The center circle (#5) is Jerusalem or a similar location with onion domed minarets. The eastern circle (#9) is Near East Asia or Persia with its decorative tent like structure, south (#7) is an African location, north (#3) is Germanic in nature and west (#1) lies somewhere in western Europe. Take either the decorative architecture around, or within, the circles or the linking "bridges" as indicators. If you rotated this "map" any other way, the locations would make no sense. "
************************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Monday, June 19, 2006 9:51 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Christine de Pizan and the Voynich Manuscript
Keith wrote Monday, June 19, 2006 10:18 AM:
" ...... I think the upper tub lower flanges were added when the text was written........ "
" Christine: I was going to suggest that the picture of the building of the City of Ladies, with Dame Justice holding a thermalite block, waiting for the cement to be applied, tells me that it was being built without foundations? "
Hello Keith
In VMS f81r, the upper tub's nearer upper flange, at the right end, has some green paint (tub fluid) bleeding over the flange. And at that point there is a smudgy line that goes downward and contacts the o in the o-ribbon-9 word. There is something odd about that, it still seems to me.
When Lady Reason is helping Cristine build the City, she says to Christine:
"Get up, daughter! Without waiting any longer, let us go to the Field of Letters. There the City of Ladies will be founded on a flat and fertile plain, where all fruits and freshwater rivers are found and where the earth abounds in all good things."
"So now throw aside these black, dirty, and uneven stones from your work, for they will never be fitted into the fair edifice of your City." (1)
The foundation is the Field of Letters: symbols, alphabets, great literature.
Berj
(1) Earl Jeffrey Richards translation, as given in The Writings of Christine de Pizan, Selected and edited by Charity Cannon Willard, New York, Persea Books, 1994.
**************************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Tuesday, June 20, 2006 9:30 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Christine de Pizan and the Voynich Manuscript
Hello Keith
You wrote Tuesday, June 20, 2006 3:21 PM, regarding Voynich f81r:
" The green ink was not flowing as well as usual, the blue is typically poor. The writing desk was inclined quite steeply. This small area either had water spilled on it, or was deliberately thinned with water, to the extent that it ran down the page and was later erased (before the text was written). I believe some scribes used cuttlefish for this. The green colour below the right hand lady has slightly less green in it, slightly grey (thinned), and shows a watermark boundary. I got a jpg of this small area from the SID. The blue is daubed across on top of the green and the ladies. Like so much of it, the colouring appears to have been done with a blunt instrument. "
You're convincing me on that.
And you wrote regarding an illustration in Christine's MS 4431:
" The field of letters, the picture looked like sweeping up the fallen leaves. "
If you look real close at the leaves being gathered (1), you'll see that just a bit in front of Christine's right foot (the foot itself being covered by the bottom of her dress), is the letters group that resembles c-c 8, or cc8, which of course is common in the Voynich ms text also [ as is also 8cc ]. It is even easier to see this if you download the pix and adjust the image parameters.
It is significant that Christine is holding up her plain dress a bit, and showing her decorated under-dress: the symbolism is that the plainly visible covers / hides a richer hidden message. Lets go back for a moment to the other illustration where she holds up her dress also, the scene where they are building the City of Ladies (2).
Again we see Christine holding up her blue dress a bit, showing a purple under-dress. The symbolism could not be clearer: this time colors are being used to say that the plain blue outer apparent-carrier of Christine's messages, conceals the inner hidden, and far more exalted royal messages.
As a matter of fact in that illustration she seems to me loaded with symbolism.
Have a look at how she has her arms crossed to lift up her dress with her left arm, and holds the masonic trowel with her right arm. Start at the fingers of her left hand, and trace up her left arm, and around her bosom, and down her right arm, and end at the tip of the trowel. What do you see?
The ribbon symbol that is ubiquitous in the Voynich text, attached to the masonic trowel symbol.
Not only in the Voynich text, but also in one of the Voynich plant illustrations, f65v, in the most obvious possible manner, the plant displays the ribbon symbol via one of its long leaves, inbetween above and below 2 other leaf symbols.
Returning to the illustration of Christine and Lady / Dame Reason building the City, note how Christine's wimple head-dress is, in this illustration, rendered so as to strongly suggest a piece of parchment. The FOLDS in Cristine's dress are telling us something also I am sure.
At least 3 times, the prime number 5 is being featured with the building blocks. 3p is one of Cristine's basic numbers across her works. 5p figures heavily in subtle cross-verse links in Christine's last known work - The Song of Joan of Arc, 1429p, a poem wherein she all but screams prime numbers at you, explicitly and implicitly.
By studying Christine up to this point, I have become more and more convinced that she knew the "system of 9 symbols", that is the Hindu-Arabic numerals. Given that she did, then there is an even deeper level of prime numbers weavings in her Joan of Arc poem, because it shows the use of a set of escalating palindromic prime numbers - a mathematics-savvy poet's dream framework for creative and subtle composing.
Have a look at Lady Reason's sash-belt: you'll see in it Voynich symbol GC-78 (GC-N), butting against another symbol. To recognize that other symbol, turn the pix upside down: GC-121 (GC-y). These sash-belt symbols may be difficult to make out with the resolution provided by the BL online, but to the experienced Voynich student they are cystal-clear in a print of the same MS 4431 illustration that is on the cover of the book (3). Lady Reason's crown is also worth a close look.
Christine, I am finding out, referred to herself in her works in a number of different ways. The database transcriptions (4) show "Cristine" as well as "Christine", 8 and 9 letters respectively. In her L'Epitre au Dieu D'Amour, the 8th of her Cent Ballades, which she herself dates 5p/1p/1399p (5), Cristine ends with an anagram of her 8-letters name-version:
C R E I N T I S
There are 2 fairly simple linear transformations for going back and forth between CRISTINE AND CREINTIS, one including 2 cross-transpositions, the other including 3, which I'll call, for future reference, the CREINTIS-2 and CREINTIS-3 linear anagram transforms. I am wondering of course if we might apply these transforms to some of the Voynich "words" and see if they start looking a bit more like words we are all used to, and less cipherish. Perhaps some of the Voynich label words are the place to start.
Christine knew her numbers, and she well knew the allegory: the prime numbers are to the non-primes, what the gods are to mere mortals.
And we also well know that the Voynich manuscript has in it the hand of a mathematician who was a master at painting allegorically with prime numbers.
Berj
(1) http://ibs001.colo.firstnet.net.uk/britishlibrary/controller/textsearch?text=Christine&start=25&startid=1547&width=4&height=2&idx=2
(2) http://ibs001.colo.firstnet.net.uk/britishlibrary/controller/textsearch?text=Christine&start=25&startid=6795&width=4&height=2&idx=2
(3) Christine de Pizan, The Book of the City of Ladies, Translated and with an introduction and notes by Rosalind Brown-Grant, Penguin Books, 1999, ISBN 0-140-44689-3
(4) http://www.arts.ed.ac.uk/french/christine/cpstart.htm
(5) Note that the number 1 is ambiguous with respect to primality, and depending on the mathematics under consideration, may be defined either prime, 1p, or not prime, 1. When I want to emphasize that a number is a prime number, I append a "p" to it.
********************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <> Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Friday, June 23, 2006 2:16 PM To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Christine de Pizan and the Voynich Manuscript
Keith wrote Thursday, June 22, 2006 3:36 PM:
" ..... creintis .......variations of the main VMs characters...... I looked at 65v, and can obviously see the loop, but as I believe the outline herbal drawings predate the script, I feel it is unlikely to have any significance. "
Hello Keith
I'll have a lot more on CREINTIS soon - the mathematical analysis of that seemingly simple anagram has surprised even me, who already believes that Christine de Pizan knew, and used some sophisticated mathematical procedures in her works. Which leads me to:
one of the things that I stressed in the initial outline of the mcP hypothesis on the Voynich manuscript (1) was that the guiding principle in analyzing the Voynich must be what makes sense to women, and not what seems logical to men, like us. If the mcP hypothesis is essentially correct, then the mcP (and therefore the VMS as a derivative copy fragment of the mcP) is mostly of, by, and for a secret female sisterhood. For us men, or perhaps I should be less general and just say for me, it is hard enough understanding women operating out in the open, let alone when one of their brightest and best, sets about designing a secret doctrine for her sisters, a doctine to be transmitted allegorically.
And, if Christine de Pizan was the mastermind (MmsP) behind the mcP, then from her career-long concern with fighting misogynism, we can expect that the mcP will have been so thought out and designed by her, so as to take decipherment-resistance-advantage of male would-be decipherers who are not inclined to think that a woman could have created something so difficult to figure out.
Imagine a survey: we separately survey intelligent men and women - we show them Voynich page f84r, with all its variations of assumed main VMS text characters, and of course all its text peculiarities that I've described as incognito symbols (2,3). And we ask them all a simple question:
Do you think the apparent variations in the text symbols, and the apparent variations in the construction of the text-lines, especially with respect to apparent cross-line linking, are possibly significant insofar as is concerned the intended transmission of a secret message in that f84r page, and if yes, how much significant?
I wonder what the women would answer, compared with what the men would answer.
There are a lot of ideas that are explored in this Voynich forum, for the purpose of trying to understand the VMS. One idea, as you know, is variations on the hypothesis that the VMS was a kind of impressive physician's personal reference book. I find that completely unbelievable: imagine today going to a doctor, and during consultation, his / her books or computer screen display hundreds of naked women. How long would that doctor remain in practice? And imagine such a thing back in the times, hundreds of years ago, when the VMS was a new book - even more eyebrow-raising back then I would think. But nevertheless, the physician's-book and other hypotheses have been provided, more or less, with data to examine, and evaluate.
And so the same, piling up data to evaluate, must be done for the mcP hypothesis and its sub-consideration that MmsP = Christine. And so here is some more data for consideration:
In Cristine's City of Ladies book, the 3 crowned Ladies who act as Christine's guides are:
Lady Reason, who carries in her right hand a mirror.
Lady Rectitude, who carries in her right hand a ruler.
Lady Justice, who carrier in her right hand a vessel.
You can see these in Christine's BL Harley MS 4431 illustration (4): the little round mirror with a rim, the stick-like ruler, and the vessel. Now look at some of the sisters in some of the Voynich illustrations on pages:
mirror: f82r, f79v
ruler: f75r
vessel: f84r
and possibly:
* mirror or vessel in f75v;
* the sister with the very long arm looking at herself in left-hand held mirror in f84r;
* ruler and mirror, but held in left hands in f80v;
* vessel in f82v;
In the left-hand examples perhaps the symbolism of the left hand is to make the point of mistaken or false interpretation of the doctrine of Ladies Reason, Rectitude, and Justice.
To identify the origin and nature of the thinking behind the VMS, rather than identify the origin of the physical copy, we must take our clues form the symbolisms.
Berj
(1) vms-list post: VMs: General mcP Hypothesis on the Voynich Manuscript; Sunday, May 21, 2006 11:41 PM
(2) vms-list post: Re: VMs: gallows letters in Christine de Pizan's work; Wednesday, May 31, 2006 12:43 AM
(3) vms-list post: VMs: incognito symbols in the Voynich manuscript; Wednesday, June 7, 2006 1:29 AM
(4) http://ibs001.colo.firstnet.net.uk/britishlibrary/controller/textsearch?text=Christine&start=25&&idx=1&startid=6797
*****************
From : Berj N. Ensanian <>
Reply-To : vms-list@voynich.net
Sent : Friday, June 23, 2006 8:24 PM
To : vms-list@voynich.net
Subject : Re: VMs: Christine de Pizan and the Voynich Manuscript
Hello Michael
You wrote Thursday, June 22, 2006 7:03 PM:
" ........ Again, I assume the numeric enumeration is not "the message", but a clue to breaking a code. Has that been successfully applied to any of her attributed works? .........
........ My initial reaction was that a 2:1:2:1:2:.. sequence of easter-egging the letters is a straight -foward way of coding an anagram. Your post goes on to suggest that this be applied to the VMS. There, my reaction was "wouldn't that have already been well explored?"........
.......... By constantly changing the transposition formula page-by-page, perhaps cracking attempts against the text as a homogeneous collection would be foiled. ........ "
The numbers in Christine and also the Voynich Manuscript seem to me to be used as a kind of "language of numbers". When we speak or write a sentence, there are many implied but invisible relationships between the overt communications elements, but that operate critically in making the communication, be it speech or text, function. Needless to say, the sophistication of communication depends on what both the author and recipient are familiar with.
So also with the language of numbers. It is for example, impossible for me to speak or write "May", that is the month, without simultaneously thinking "the prime number 5". And should I happen to need to write May 10, I am, effortlessly, thinking "2 and 5 are the prime factors of 10, a 2-digit number in the Hindu-Arabic system that was revered by Pythagoras et al and happens to have some peculiar aspects in areas ranging from special status in some numbers relationships, through biology, to antenna radiation patterns", and so on and so forth.
And I might, later on in the same communication, choose my words, in a sort of poetic-license fashion, to include "25" or "520" or LII, or "lobe" or "staircase" etc., if for no other reason than that the ability to communicate in some language or languages just naturally precipitates communications of that language, but also optimistically, to see if some of my communicants speak and appreciate my brand of "multi-lingual" also, and thereby find interesting people to talk with.
The overt language elements are the carrier, which may be simultaneously modulated by many signal streams, and like with a complex radio transmission, the portion of the transmitted signal's spectrum that is usefully detected, depends upon the receiving system.
And as I communicate, say in plain English, simultaneously the language of numbers is in my thoughts consciously, unconsciously, and subconsciously. And accordingly affects the communications I construct and receive from others.
And so when I read Christine, and "read", at this stage still only allegorically, the Voynich Manuscript, and I recognize, often, my own language, then I think: the language of numbers and geometry was natural to this author!
So far, still very, very early in my study of Christine, I have not come across anything suggesting that her mathematical aspects have received deep attention, much less from mathematics-trained scholars. And although Willard, in her indispensible biography, omits a lot of to-me critical details, she does make very sure that her readers get the message that Christine revered her father, and that one of Cristine's primary conceptions of her father was: mathematician. (1)
In answering Keith in another branch of this thread earlier today, I mentioned that I will soon have a lot more on Christine's CREINTIS. It's matter of finishing up adding some useful features to a computer program that I wrote during the analysis that I'll make available to all who would like to have it, on or off-list, so that they can study for themselves what I found in Christine, and what happens to Voynich "words" when they are manipulated by the transformation from which CREINTIS results.
Of course anagrams analysis of the Voynich text is old hat long ago. The legendary Friedman ended his Voynich-attacks days by issuing his conclusions in the form of an anagram, that reads as a plain English statement, and according to others deciphers into saying that the VMS text is a synthetic language. (2,3)
That Friedman used an ANAGRAM to state his case, may have been more than just a cryptographer's insurance policy. He might have sensed the right road to the solution. But as far as I know, Christine de Pizan did not enter the consciousness of Voynichville denizens until the mcP hypothesis one month and two days ago.
I have been thinking a lot about your Perigee: Zero theory / hypothesis (4), and which you already know I like very much because of certain general overlaps with the Voynich mcP hypothesis, including that in medieval times there started, around a grave concern, a network of communicating intellectuals. I have been thinking of what could be a good possibility for resolving all this better in the Voynich and Christine material. And it occurred to me that Christine was, especially so in the earlier part of her career, very much concerned with Fortune, Dame Fortune as she puts it.
And the common symbol of Fortune back in those days was: a great big wheel. And we have wheels galore in the Voynich manuscript! Now in Voynichville we usually don't call them wheels, but rather "circular diagrams" etc., but wheels they are, and even wheels within wheels. Plenty of them.
So I am wondering if what the Perigee: Zero project is producing will come around to connecting directly with Christine and the Voynich manuscript via the wheel of Fortune. (5)
Berj
(1) Christine de Pizan, Her Life and Works, A Biography by Charity Cannon Willard, New York, Persea Books, 1984.
(2) see section 6.5 in D'Imperio
(3) caution: the term "synthetic language" can have different meanings from what Friedman and Tiltman meant.
(4) http://PerigeeZero.org
(5) :-)
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